Obama is officially running for President

If Hilary Clinton wins (I am not voting for this douche either) I an gonna shoot myself.. no for reals I'll do it!
 
[quote name='fuzz']If Hilary Clinton wins (I am not voting for this douche either) I an gonna shoot myself.. not for reals I'll do it![/quote]

You mean like how everyone who said they'd leave the US did so after Bush was re-elected? ;)
 
I just want to ask those who are so enthusiatic about voting for him, why? He's a relative newbie in politics, but somehow went from state senator to U.S. Senator in only 8 years and he's already on the fast track to the Democratic presidential nomination. All I've heard about him is that he's trying to stop smoking and was bare-chested on a magazine cover. I'm not trying to bait anyone, I just want to know why there's such a buzz. Aside from being against Iraq, I haven't heard anything about any of his positions on major issues.
 
I am in Canada now...

I'd love to se Obama elected.
[quote name='Hex']You mean like how everyone who said they'd leave the US did so after Bush was re-elected? ;)[/quote]
 
Bill Richardson! 100 times more qualified than Obama and Clinton put together, yet no one knows who he is.
 
[quote name='dopa345']I just want to ask those who are so enthusiatic about voting for him, why? He's a relative newbie in politics, but somehow went from state senator to U.S. Senator in only 8 years and he's already on the fast track to the Democratic presidential nomination. All I've heard about him is that he's trying to stop smoking and was bare-chested on a magazine cover. I'm not trying to bait anyone, I just want to know why there's such a buzz. Aside from being against Iraq, I haven't heard anything about any of his positions on major issues.[/QUOTE]

I read his book (The Audacity of Hope) a few weeks ago, and it really impressed me. Of course, I approached the book thinking "well, here's something that's going to be used to suggest to me that Obama is the kind of thoughtful individual who looks at things from all angles before making an informed decision, and thus he's an ideal presidential candidate." It was a cynical, but, I feel, accurate take on the book. Nevertheless, rather than posturing himself as a redux of Clinton (Bill) as the "great triangulator," Obama was able to present evidence from his political past that he's not aligned to solely democratic interests, though he ends up there the majority of the time.

He's willing to stand up to organized labor, which is an issue I'm similarly torn on (I have great empathy for working-class Americans at the same time I recognize that unions are too frequently self-serving bureaucracies that stiff the worker as much as the corporation). I like his thoughts on universal health care, and social services. My major greivance with what he lays out in the book is this: I've never been the kind of person to get up in arms about "tax n' spend Democrats," though I think that's because by the time I was born, government spending was de facto, no matter who was in office. I've never seen, outside of history books, anything resembling "fiscal responsibility." Moreover, if we're gonna spend out the ass, I suggest that *we* pay for what *we* get, and don't shovel debts onto future generations to pay; it's selfish and irresponsible. That said, Obama's plans for health care and social services seem to have struck me with a sense of "How in the fuck are we gonna pay for that!?!?!" Overall, though, it was a good read.

I think, aside from his plans, he represents a moral direction that we ought to head as a nation. We have become a slovenly, gluttonous nation infatuated with instant gratification, conspicuous consumption, and no regard for anything we do as individuals and as a society. As people starve, we get mad if there are three cars in the drive-thru. As people die, we focus on asserting our individual freedoms by driving the biggest, most obnoxious, natural resource-wasting vehicles we can. As corporations rob us blind, we complain about people on welfare, and not those who earn $212 million severance packages for fucking up a corporation so bad he had to be fired. As a nation, we cut off our nose to spite our face, as more and more skilled workers and educated people have little to no job opportunities, thanks to a combination of "globalization" and the lack for genuine entrepreneurialist endeavors thanks to large corporations and big-box stores - all because we wanted a cheaper roll of "Brawny." Obama, to me, far more than Clinton can do, represents a charismatic leader (and let's not fool ourselves, character matters more than anything in this day and age) who brings a combination of John Kennedy's "ask what you can do for your country" and Gerald Ford's "great healer" to the game. We desperately need both; to heal wounds of buying into the dichotomy of "the two Americas," the war between the right and left which will ultimately do us in, and focus on what we can do to gain strength as a nation, to function as a single nation, not always agreeing, but not insisting that one is out to kill the other. A nation that wants to fight terror where it is, but not without multilateral support, an assurance of terror groups' presence, and without depleting our military and financial resources.

Now, that's a tall order, and I don't really think he'll be able to fulfill all our wildest dreams. But I don't expect that. I expect that he'll do a lot more to quash the cynical belief that we're just electing another Washington asshole to a position where nothing will be done different from the way it has been done for decades or longer. And that's something we desperately need.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']
Now, that's a tall order, and I don't really think he'll be able to fulfill all our wildest dreams. But I don't expect that. I expect that he'll do a lot more to quash the cynical belief that we're just electing another Washington asshole to a position where nothing will be done different from the way it has been done for decades or longer. And that's something we desperately need.[/quote]

Bingo, this is the reason I am pro-Obama.

Also, if you question his experience and what effect it would have on this country if he were to become president, look up what experience Lincoln had. ;)
 
[quote name='mykevermin']*obama summary*[/quote]
Wow, thanks a lot dude. I didn't really know what he stood for either, but damn, now I'm compelled to read his book (Now if only it weren't like $25! rabblerabblerabble). I certainly hope he turns out like you've postulated.
 
everytime I hear his name, I keep on picturing this guy.

osama%20bin%20laden%20(bert%20is%20evil)_jpg.jpg
 
I much prefer Rudy Giuliani win the election over both Hillary and Obama. Obama imo is too new and Hillary is a douche. Unfortuantly it looks like MCcain is gonna win the republican nomination.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Now, that's a tall order, and I don't really think he'll be able to fulfill all our wildest dreams. But I don't expect that. I expect that he'll do a lot more to quash the cynical belief that we're just electing another Washington asshole to a position where nothing will be done different from the way it has been done for decades or longer. And that's something we desperately need.[/QUOTE]

Interesting thoughts, myke. While I don't think that any Democrat or Republican candidate can do this for me, perhaps they could for most Americans, an if so I think that would be a good thing for sure. Part of being able to get things done is thinking we actually can get things done and that it's not hopeless, and so attitude change is very important in anything really.

What I'd really like to see in the candidates is someone come forward and tell us that we are going to have to get real. We can't continue ridiculous budgets, ridiculous over-consumption, ridiculous retirement non-planning and ridiculous educational systems any more or we are eventually going to run the great thing that is America into the ground. It's time for a "new deal" in the vein of realizing we are going to have to make some changes (read: sacrifices) in order to fight terrorism, control our budget, plan for our future and do all the other things we need to do. I think we have all the tools if we only have the political courage to use them...but who has that courage who can realistically be elected?
 
[quote name='miktau']I much prefer Rudy Giuliani win the election over both Hillary and Obama. Obama imo is too new and Hillary is a douche. Unfortuantly it looks like MCcain is gonna win the republican nomination.[/QUOTE]

Standing on a street corner answering questions =/= experience worthy of making you president
 
[quote name='elprincipe']What I'd really like to see in the candidates is someone come forward and tell us that we are going to have to get real. We can't continue ridiculous budgets, ridiculous over-consumption, ridiculous retirement non-planning and ridiculous educational systems any more or we are eventually going to run the great thing that is America into the ground. It's time for a "new deal" in the vein of realizing we are going to have to make some changes (read: sacrifices) in order to fight terrorism, control our budget, plan for our future and do all the other things we need to do. I think we have all the tools if we only have the political courage to use them...but who has that courage who can realistically be elected?[/quote]

That would only happen with a drastic change in what government is today. Less government, more accountability, the elimination of partisan politics (I affectionately call it the political version of the Bloods vs. the Crips), and a real effort to eliminate conflicts of interest.

Those politicians won't give up that power easily.
 
[quote name='GuilewasNK']That would only happen with a drastic change in what government is today. Less government, more accountability, the elimination of partisan politics (I affectionately call it the political version of the Bloods vs. the Crips), and a real effort to eliminate conflicts of interest.

Those politicians won't give up that power easily.[/QUOTE]

It's true. It's going to be very difficult/unlikely for these necessary changes to be made by the two big political parties...which is one big reason I advocate moving away from the horrible curse of the two-party system.
 
There is two factors I've thought about with Obama, positive and negative:
1) He's a senator, and I think the last senator elected President was JFK. There's something about voting records that seems to damage Presidential campaigns (see Kerry, John: 2004) and
2) He's relatively new to national politics. After seeing the effects that seasoned politicians have had in Washington, a fresh influence may be welcomed.

I realize those thoughts contradict each other somewhat, but that seems to be the nature of American politics.
 
[quote name='ITDEFX']everytime I hear his name, I keep on picturing this guy.

osama%20bin%20laden%20%28bert%20is%20evil%29_jpg.jpg
[/quote]

I usually think of this guy:
t_baraka.gif
 
I need to know much more about him before I can make a sincere judgement. Luckily, we have plenty of time.

Saw Christopher Dodd on Face the Nation Sunday. Liked what he said. Doesn't mean I'll vote for him, but I like what he said.
 
My first choice for president is Obama, then Ron Paul, then McCain or Rudy.

I might move to Iceland if Hilary is elected, considering her main platform is stripping us of our basic human rights (AKA playing video games)
 
Obama is running on the wii60 platform, im voting for him. Hell at least this time I get to vote, last time I didnt get a chance to vote against bush
 
[quote name='Iron Clad Burrito']You'll be disappointed this time, too.[/quote]

why? because I can't vote against Bush again since he's ineligible to run for president? Or you know my opinions on other presidential candidates without me saying them?
 
[quote name='fuzz']If Hilary Clinton wins (I am not voting for this douche either) I an gonna shoot myself.. no for reals I'll do it![/QUOTE]

[quote name='fuzz']It's all about McCain (when is decides to run) WOOO![/QUOTE]

Look, this isn't Xbox Live. If you want to have a political stance, we'd like to see *why* you feel a certain way. Do you support McCain because he was against the Military Commission Act based on his experience as a POW, and then three days later voted for it when nothing of any substance was changed? Talk about "I was against it before I was for it" (that's not exactly what Kerry said, was it?).

So, what about McCain impresses you, and what about Clinton or Obama bother you? If you're a dyed in the wool Republican, why support McCain, and not Giuliani, Huckabee, or Romney? Newt Gingrich, perhaps?
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Look, this isn't Xbox Live. If you want to have a political stance, we'd like to see *why* you feel a certain way. Do you support McCain because he was against the Military Commission Act based on his experience as a POW, and then three days later voted for it when nothing of any substance was changed? Talk about "I was against it before I was for it" (that's not exactly what Kerry said, was it?).

So, what about McCain impresses you, and what about Clinton or Obama bother you? If you're a dyed in the wool Republican, why support McCain, and not Giuliani, Huckabee, or Romney? Newt Gingrich, perhaps?[/quote]
Look I have nothing against any party whatsoever, and I have no real political stance. But with that said, McCain supports my point of view on a lot of things, such as the war in Iraq and stem cell research. He wants tax dollars to be spent on schooling and things that will help America out more than hurt it. I do not know Obama's views on the issue(s) at hand, and maybe jumped the gun when I said those things. But I am more than willing to look further into any parties views on any issue they may have.
 
[quote name='dastly75']why? because I can't vote against Bush again since he's ineligible to run for president? Or you know my opinions on other presidential candidates without me saying them?[/quote]

The former. The latter will likely happen too, but I can't predict the future. ;) We are always disappointed.
 
At least there's a good chance that there will be at least 2 decent candidates running (Obama for the Dems, McCain or Guliani for the GOP) unlike the "lesser of two evil" elections we've had for the last two (and yes, I believe Bush was the lesser of the two evils in both).
 
[quote name='dopa345']At least there's a good chance that there will be at least 2 decent candidates running (Obama for the Dems, McCain or Guliani for the GOP) unlike the "lesser of two evil" elections we've had for the last two (and yes, I believe Bush was the lesser of the two evils in both).[/QUOTE]

Agreed. I'm getting the popcorn ready for the debates. Dodd v Clinton should be outstanding. Is there an over/under on the Plastic Fantastic's (Edwards) smile time?
 
[quote name='dopa345']At least there's a good chance that there will be at least 2 decent candidates running (Obama for the Dems, McCain or Guliani for the GOP) unlike the "lesser of two evil" elections we've had for the last two (and yes, I believe Bush was the lesser of the two evils in both).[/quote]

Quoted for truth and great justice.

[quote name='CocheseUGA']Is there an over/under on the Plastic Fantastic's (Edwards) smile time?[/quote]

Personally I give it til Sept 30, 2007. I'll be very surprised if he makes it to Iowa.
 
[quote name='fuzz']He wants tax dollars to be spent on schooling and things that will help America out more than hurt it.[/QUOTE]

Come on, this is about the most vaccuous statement I've ever seen here (that's certainly saying something). A candidate who wants to spend money on things that help the country out more than hurt it...and schools! Has Hell frozen over?!?!

Really, surely you can do much better than that for any candidate. If you are for someone (McCain in this case), surely it is for a reason...and not the "reason" I just quoted! I'm not trying to knock you supporting any candidate, just asking why.
 
Every ellection I find myself painted into the familiar corner of voting with my wallet, as I despise the fact that my only 'real' choice is between two sets of pre-packaged ideologies (red vs blue). Obama looked like a good candidate, until I did some research and found he was adamantly against moving social security to a more 401k like form, earmarked for the payee. What started as a program that pulled America out of depression is now little more than a Ponzi sceme.

Think about it... if someone set up a private, optional social security, with the first investors buying in for the promise of recieving money from subsequent investors without creating any form of value, they would throw that person in jail in a heartbeat. Simple fact is, one generation is going to have to 'take one for the team' and pay in to SS, but never get to draw it. Well, that or the country will eventually go bankrupt. I agree that people need aid. My pst-college job will already place me in a higher earning bracket than most, and I am more than happy to give some of my income to those in need. However, I would like some of that social security that comes out of my paycheck to be earmarked for my wife and I.

I don't understand why this idea is so hard to get behind... especially if you backed it with t-bills instead of stocks.

This and the dismal propability that Obama would ever cut taxes (I'm coming out of college with a wife and a baby and the gov is gonna tax me about 25% of my total income) is enough to dis-suade me from voting for him.

Alas, voting fiscally usually means supporting anti-gay marriage and the diminishment of freedom. Sigh... what's a fiscally minded moderate to do...
 
[quote name='permablue']Every ellection I find myself painted into the familiar corner of voting with my wallet, as I despise the fact that my only 'real' choice is between two sets of pre-packaged ideologies (red vs blue). Obama looked like a good candidate, until I did some research and found he was adamantly against moving social security to a more 401k like form, earmarked for the payee. What started as a program that pulled America out of depression is now little more than a Ponzi sceme.

Think about it... if someone set up a private, optional social security, with the first investors buying in for the promise of recieving money from subsequent investors without creating any form of value, they would throw that person in jail in a heartbeat. Simple fact is, one generation is going to have to 'take one for the team' and pay in to SS, but never get to draw it. Well, that or the country will eventually go bankrupt. I agree that people need aid. My pst-college job will already place me in a higher earning bracket than most, and I am more than happy to give some of my income to those in need. However, I would like some of that social security that comes out of my paycheck to be earmarked for my wife and I.

I don't understand why this idea is so hard to get behind... especially if you backed it with t-bills instead of stocks.[/quote]

Well, most candidates won't touch it. The Democrats were quite successful in their fear-mongering tactics in defeating any reform proposals after 2004, even going so far as to claim there was no problem. That third rail really is electrified because the public is dead set against reform even though it's desperately needed. Of course, now that the Democrats have back the majority they could look into real solutions to a real problem, but I'm not holding my breath.

[quote name='permablue']This and the dismal propability that Obama would ever cut taxes (I'm coming out of college with a wife and a baby and the gov is gonna tax me about 25% of my total income) is enough to dis-suade me from voting for him.[/quote]

You're underestimating. Maybe 25% income tax, but you aren't counting state income tax, property tax, sales tax...and fees, if you have investments capital gains, etc. If that total was 25% we'd have a much smaller government!

[quote name='permablue']Alas, voting fiscally usually means supporting anti-gay marriage and the diminishment of freedom. Sigh... what's a fiscally minded moderate to do...[/QUOTE]

Not vote for Democrats or Republicans, as everyone else should look into as well. Neither party is fiscally responsible, both are for the diminshment of freedom (in different ways), and both place what's best for their party's position over what's best for the country.
 
Holy crap! There are intelligent people out there on the internet! You are also correct that the 25% is only federal income tax (I am trying to draw up a rough budget and only had time to factor in my federal tax bracket info). Its really disheartening to know that I put myself through college only to be able to barely support my family, even after I got a job beating the median income for other graduates of my major.

I've made wise decisions, plan on being financially responcible, and the government is taking enough money away that I will be barely able to save for the future (while my earned money is going to pay, at least in part, for people that did not do such planning). Its enough to make me sick, but the avenues for recourse are virtually non-existant.
 
[quote name='fuzz']If Hilary Clinton wins (I am not voting for this douche either) I an gonna shoot myself.. no for reals I'll do it![/quote]
If she wins Im moving to Iraq, Ill be safer there.
 
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