2009 MLB Discussion Thread

[quote name='bigdaddybruce44']I doubt they hand Hamels the ball, not after his "can't wait for the season to be over" comments. Of course, I don't know who they would hand the ball to in that case, but I don't think you can give it to Hamels. Anyone on any amount of rest would be better than him at this point. If it goes go 7, and they hand Hamels the ball, I will run to the Stadium and give Manuel a big kiss.[/QUOTE]

Its sounding like J.A. Happ will be getting the ball in Game 7. At least that's what I, and I'm sure every Phillies fan, would want to happen. He's a great up and coming pitcher, it's just a shame they haven't let him have another start in the postseason. He was a little shaky in his NLDS start, but give him another chance. I assure you he won't do any worse than Hamels has been doing.
 
Why didn't they just pull out Lee earlier and pump him up with B12 for a game 7? He could have probably done five strong innings if they go that far. I know im on crack but two days rest should be ok if It's the final game for them for months or what not.
 
Considering they didn't want to pitch him on three days rest, I doubt they would then turn around and pitch him on two.

EDIT: Might be time to move Tex out of the three spot. He has looked lost the whole postseason, but has gotten a pass, because the few hits he has gotten have been big and, of course, his defense is huge. Slide Matsui into the three, Posada bats fifth, and Tex goes into the sixth spot.
 
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Nice rally by the Yanks late. Sucks to see them come up short, but I'm sorry if I feel like Philly ESCAPED with a win in this game. Just need to see AB's like this on Wednesday, and this series is over.
 
I think Pedro is gonna pitch fine for game six. It's not like he was horrible in game 2. The Phillies didn't give him enough run support.

If they can manage to sneak by in game six game seven will be the bigger question, because Lee is still the only real big bright side on Phillies pitching. But after seeing the Sox come back down from 3-0 anything is possible at this point, especially since the Phillies only need two games now. Take one game at a time.
 
[quote name='Monsta Mack']I think Pedro is gonna pitch fine for game six. It's not like he was horrible in game 2. The Phillies didn't give him enough run support.

If they can manage to sneak by in game six game seven will be the bigger question, because Lee is still the only real big bright side on Phillies pitching. But after seeing the Sox come back down from 3-0 anything is possible at this point, especially since the Phillies only need two games now. Take one game at a time.[/QUOTE]

I agree that that's the approach they should have. But the Yankees only need one game. And this Yankee team is far better than the team from 2004. You can make an argument that Girardi "mismanaged" this game (although Gaudin hasn't made a start in about a month...so there's no telling how he would have thrown). But the bottom line is, he's just gotta piece together his pitching staff to eek out one more win.

Pettitte may not be dominant on 3 days rest, but AJ was horrible, and they STILL almost got it done...against Cliff Lee. Also, game 2 was the first time the Yanks had seen Pedro in quite a while, and Posada didn't even play in that game. All things considered, I feel good about the way game 5 went (mostly concerning the bats and a few of the bullpen arms).

Most people didn't expect the Yankees to win this game in the first place because of Lee pitching. And while Lee wasn't very sharp and the game definitely was winnable, I still maintain that the Yanks are in no worse position than had they thrown Gaudin. AJ on regular rest can be just as terrible as Andy on short rest. Joe gave AJ a shot to be the hero and he failed. Now, Andy gets that shot.

The difference is, Andy is a battler. He may be 37 and he may be tired. But he's got one game to reach the top of the mountain once again. If he can't dig deep and find the will to get it done, then CC gets his chance. And if all three fail, then it just wasn't meant to be.
 
I definitely still feel really good. The Yankees only need to win one game at home out of two. And yes, we all know everyone wants to bring up 2004, but they were bringing up 2004 when the Yankees lost Game 5 of the ALCS, and they shut the door on that one real quick. Anything can happen, but we all know the odds of someone blowing a 3-1 lead in the WS, and this is a different Yankee team than the one that blew 2004.

Despite the fact that I think Clueless Joe Jr. did not set this rotation up properly, I still feel confident in Game 6. Not only was Game 2 the first time we saw in Pedro in a long time, but the bats were kind of struggling at that point. For most of the playoffs, they've been kind of either grinding out of a run or two with walks, errors, etc or hitting solo home runs. But the last three games, the bats are really come alive. The lineup has been relentless. They score some runs, the Yankees score right back. Even yesterday, when they could have easily mailed in it against Lee, especially after Coke gave up those bombs, they kept fighting, got to him, and damn near came all the way back. With their full line-up on the field tomorrow, I'm confident they can put up four or five on Perdo and probably chase him earlier in this game, getting into the soft underbelly of that bullpen.

The real key is Andy getting a scoreless couple of innings under his belt, and the Yankees putting up some runs in that time frame. They need to put the Phillies back on the run.
 
I think Hamels goes Game 7 if there is one. Wednesday we are going to see Pedro until he gives up 3 runs and then J.A. Happ for 4 innings or so. I think Pedro is going to get lit up. He was getting several weeks rest between starts and now he is going on 4 or 5 days or whatever it's been. He is crafty but the Yankees will have their full lineup (remember Molina played in Game 2) and they've already hit against him so familiarity plays a role. I think Girardi was going to get criticized no matter who he pitched last night - I think he made the right call giving the ball to A.J. - he was great in Game 2 and you want your best guys out there. If they had won it would have been viewed as a brilliant move.
 
Couple of things regarding yesterday. Burnett stunk but that could have easily happened in game 6. Girardi cannot start Gaudin who has pitched 1 inning in the past month and stinks against lefties. His National League numbers this year are atrocious.

2 faults from last night. One is that Coke should have been yanked from the game after the Utley homerun. Second is that Pena should have been pinch running for Matsui after Hideki hit the single. Fallacy of the predetermined outcome in effect. Pena was more likely to break up a double play, steal second, advance to second on a pitch in the dirt, score a run and increase the Yankees chances of getting Arod up in that inning with runners on base to do some damage. Down 3 runs Girardi cannot be worrying about who is going to pinch hit or take over for defense in extra innings. Plus Matsui pinch hit for the pitcher and was only going to see another at bat if the Yankees batted around. The Yankees would have most likely had the lead if that had happened.
 
[quote name='wildcpac']Couple of things regarding yesterday. Burnett stunk but that could have easily happened in game 6. Girardi cannot start Gaudin who has pitched 1 inning in the past month and stinks against lefties. His National League numbers this year are atrocious.[/QUOTE]

As a manager, you should always set your players up for the most success. Joe has not done that at all. Not only would AJ had extra rest as the Game 6 starter, he would have been pitching in Yankee Stadium. His road numbers this year were completely awful. 4.59 ERA and a .264 average against, which is trouble for a guy who walks and hits people like Burnett. Also, removing Posada from an AL park lineup is not as bad as removing him from NL park lineup. That Yankee lineup last night was an absolute joke. 5-8 and the pitcher couldn't hit me.

Now, you have Andy on three days. Disaster waiting to happen. He hasn't made a start on FOUR days rest since early September. Almost two months now he's been getting long rest. Now, you're gonna only give him three days? He hasn't pitched on just three days since like 2004. And according to Jon Heyman, Pettitte basically told teammates that he had nothing in Game 3.

When you have three shots to win one game, you need to strengthen the fort and give yourself the best chance to win all the games or at least two of them. Joe gave the Yankees a bad shot at winning 5 and 6. The only hope they have for Game 6 now is that the Phillies continue to swing at shit and/or Pedro suffers from not having a week+ rest like he has been getting.
 
[quote name='bigdaddybruce44']As a manager, you should always set your players up for the most success. Joe has not done that at all. Not only would AJ had extra rest as the Game 6 starter, he would have been pitching in Yankee Stadium. His road numbers this year were completely awful. 4.59 ERA and a .264 average against, which is trouble for a guy who walks and hits people like Burnett. Also, removing Posada from an AL park lineup is not as bad as removing him from NL park lineup. That Yankee lineup last night was an absolute joke. 5-8 and the pitcher couldn't hit me.

Now, you have Andy on three days. Disaster waiting to happen. He hasn't made a start on FOUR days rest since early September. Almost two months now he's been getting long rest. Now, you're gonna only give him three days? He hasn't pitched on just three days since like 2004. And according to Jon Heyman, Pettitte basically told teammates that he had nothing in Game 3.

When you have three shots to win one game, you need to strengthen the fort and give yourself the best chance to win all the games or at least two of them. Joe gave the Yankees a bad shot at winning 5 and 6. The only hope they have for Game 6 now is that the Phillies continue to swing at shit and/or Pedro suffers from not having a week+ rest like he has been getting.[/QUOTE]

Careful now, Bruce. You're starting to panic. Just breathe, man. It was a gamble, and it didn't work out. But don't act like AJ is some stalwart who just goes out and takes care of business when he's allowed to have his routine. Girardi has done everything to accomodate him all freaking year, and he STILL loses his shit about 40% of the time. As many have pointed out, he was off from the 1st inning. That had nothing to do with rest.

And if I'm picking my poison here, I'd MUCH rather have AJ freak out in game 5 than in game 6, after already giving away game 5 with Gaudin vs Lee. Can you imagine how high Philly would be flying then? As things stand now, their best pitcher is essentially done for the series (outside of MAYBE an inning or two in game 7), and they have no closer. Even the attempt at "establishing" a new closer last night almost blew up in their faces.

While I'm sure they are happy that they're still alive, how good can they feel about knocking our starter out after 2+ innings, having their ace pitch into the 8th with a 6 run lead, and STILL being one swing of the bat away from blowing the game? The thought of Andy going on 3 days rest scares the hell out of me too. But dammit, I believe he's going to sack up and do what the team needs him to do. I said this on the ESPN board, but I think what it basically boiled down to is that Andy's reputation as a battler is worth more than AJ's reputation of being reliable.

Yeah, Andy said he was zapped in game 3, but that doesn't mean he's beat. Some days you just feel like shit, and of course the 1.5 hour delay didn't help things. But if he can't get charged up to pitch a potential championship clincher, then what the hell did he come back for? All he needs is some run support. Thanks to the last couple games, I feel better about the bats than I have the entire postseason. Sure, clinching in 5 would have been nice, but I'm not about to get all doom and gloom about a 3-2 lead with 2 home games left. It's just time to buckle down and fucking do it.
 
Hey, if you wanna mock me for being realistic, that's cool. I hope I'm wrong, and you and wildcpac and the rest of the Yankee fans who drank the "a three man rotation is a grand idea" Kool-Aid can all say you told me so. I don't wanna say I told you so. But in the end, I'm pretty sure I will, and most experts do, too. There's a reason why no one has really tried a 3-man World Series rotation out in the last 20 years. Because it's a bad idea. If you had three CC's, that's great. He's a horse. He'd probably pitch on two days rest if you told him to. AJ and Andy are not horses. They are not build like CC. They are not 300 pound monsters.

And I love how everyone just assumed Gaudin was some throwaway. Anyone actually watch him pitch when he got to New York? He was beyond serviceable. I don't care what his numbers were on an awful team. I never care what anyone's numbers are on any other team. If they prove they can play with the Yankees, I'm in. I'm game. I'm there. How many guys have had brilliant numbers with shitty teams, get to New York, and blow? All that matters is what you do when you get to the Yankees. And Gaudin pitched pretty well. He's got good stuff. And most importantly, he had not faced the Phillies this year. They hadn't see him in awhile. That's an automatic advantage to the pitcher. If you don't think there was a good shot he could give you a 5 inning, 3 run performance, I don't know what to tell you. Could he have been blown away? Of course. AJ was. But to think it was like throwing Ian Kennedy out there or something, that's just silly.

And when it comes to starting pitching in the playoffs, don't assume anything. Everyone assumed it was a big mistake for the Phils not starting Lee in Game 4, even though he had no history on 3-days rest. Everyone thought Blanton would get bombed. But he didn't. He held his own, and the Yankees really got the last two runs on him with some cheap hits.

Lastly, if you don't think the Phils have all the confidence in the world, you're crazy. Let's say they win Game 5 by beating Gaudin, whether it was a blowout or close game. Don't matter. Either way, they are going back to New York to face AJ on plenty of rest, after he pretty much made them look foolish in Game 2. Now, they are going into New York to face Andy on short rest, after he had to pull a smoke and mirrors act to get out of Game 3 alive with more than full rest. Then, in my scenario, if they did beat AJ, they'd still be facing CC, but he'd have a fully-rested Andy backing him or prepared for an extra-inning affair. Now, you have AJ on two days.

Anyway you wanna look at it, Joe did not set his team up with the best chance to win one of these games. He put the Yankees at a disadvantage or in a push in every, single one of them, whereas they would have been at a disadvantage in only one with my scenario and a much, much, much bigger advantage in the other two.
 
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Gaudin had a 4-10 record with a 5 plus era and a 1.5 whip this year pitching in the NL West. Lefties hit a robust .300 plus off of him this year with around a 450 slugging. He also gave up 7 homeruns in 42 innings. He pitched 1 inning in the past month. Throwing him out there in that extreme hitters park against one of the best offense in baseball with Cliff Lee pitching is an Automatic loss. If AJ had been mediocore and not horrible, the Yankees are riding down the Canyon of Heroes tommorow instead of playing a game 6.

I understand that people wanted AJ to go in game 6 on 5 days rest. I saw the argument that people made before the game. I understood it. I saw a Phillies lineup that changed their approach and had a pretty good gameplan following game 2 against AJ. That could have easily happened in game 6. Is it guaranteed? Nope. AJ has been a complete coin toss pitcher this year. Dr Jeckyl and Mr Hyde. AJ had the chance to win the World Series, win the MVP award and put himself in Yankee History. He flat out stunk and I think it had more to do with the Phillies offense, their gameplan and AJ''s ineffectiveness than 3 days rest.

Yankees have a 3-2 lead with HFA in the last 2 if needed against Pedro and if nec Hamels. The Yankees have a 3-2 lead in a series with Tex and Cano are hitting like a combined .150. You can fault the manager for some things but the players still have to produce.
 
[quote name='bigdaddybruce44']Lastly, if you don't think the Phils have all the confidence in the world, you're crazy. Let's say they win Game 5 by beating Gaudin, whether it was a blowout or close game. Don't matter. Either way, they are going back to New York to face AJ on plenty of rest, after he pretty much made them look foolish in Game 2. Now, they are going into New York to face Andy on short rest, after he had to pull a smoke and mirrors act to get out of Game 3 alive with more than full rest. Then, in my scenario, if they did beat AJ, they'd still be facing CC, but he'd have a fully-rested Andy backing him or prepared for an extra-inning affair. Now, you have AJ on two days.

Anyway you wanna look at it, Joe did not set his team up with the best chance to win one of these games. He put the Yankees at a disadvantage or in a push in every, single one of them, whereas they would have been at a disadvantage in only one with my scenario and a much, much, much bigger advantage in the other two.[/QUOTE]

I wasn't mocking you dude. But it's crazy to give up on a team that had a 3-1 lead just because their pitchers are on one less day of rest. In reality, all it SHOULD translate to is Andy not being able to go as deep into the game. If he gives us 5-6 innings, I'm fine with that. Robertson looked fantastic the other night, and even Aceves looked reasonably solid. But if the pitcher psyches himself out and bombs in the first inning (as AJ did), you'd have to be nuts to blame that on one less day of rest.

I'm not saying they won't blow it, and I won't argue that the team not really having a viable 4th starter isn't a disadvantage. But saying that Andy pulled a smoke and mirrors act is crazy. That's pitching, man. He's a pitcher now instead of a thrower. It's for that exact reason I have more faith in him than I did in AJ. How many starts has Andy had over the past 3 years that haven't been "smoke and mirrors"?

I'd argue that Pedro's pitching in game 2 was smoke and mirrors. It's getting batters out with your brain instead of your arm. Now they'll be doing it against each other. And I'm sorry, even on 3 days, I'd still bet on Andy over Pedro. I might end up eating those words, but I'll be damned if I give up on my team.
 
Also, if we're going to quote stats on how "bad" Pettitte is on short rest, this also deserves to be posted.

Pettitte is 3-1 with a 2.80 ERA in five career postseason starts on short rest. You know what game is included in that? The one everyone knows as the greatest of his career: Game 5 of the 1996 World Series (8 1/3 shutout innings against Atlanta). Game 2 of the '03 World Series is in there, too (8 2/3, one unearned run vs. Florida).

The long and short of it is, all of these numbers are from eons ago, and the only thing that matters is how Andy feels tomorrow night. In what could be his last game ever, I want to believe he's going to do something special.
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']I wasn't mocking you dude. But it's crazy to give up on a team that had a 3-1 lead just because their pitchers are on one less day of rest. In reality, all it SHOULD translate to is Andy not being able to go as deep into the game. If he gives us 5-6 innings, I'm fine with that. Robertson looked fantastic the other night, and even Aceves looked reasonably solid. But if the pitcher psyches himself out and bombs in the first inning (as AJ did), you'd have to be nuts to blame that on one less day of rest.

I'm not saying they won't blow it, and I won't argue that the team not really having a viable 4th starter isn't a disadvantage. But saying that Andy pulled a smoke and mirrors act is crazy. That's pitching, man. He's a pitcher now instead of a thrower. It's for that exact reason I have more faith in him than I did in AJ. How many starts has Andy had over the past 3 years that haven't been "smoke and mirrors"?

I'd argue that Pedro's pitching in game 2 was smoke and mirrors. It's getting batters out with your brain instead of your arm. Now they'll be doing it against each other. And I'm sorry, even on 3 days, I'd still bet on Andy over Pedro. I might end up eating those words, but I'll be damned if I give up on my team.[/QUOTE]


Great points. Couple things about Pedro. He is going to love pitching in game 6 at YS. He was also getting a ton of rest in pitch games during the post season. Far more than the normal 4 days off. His previous 3 starts all came on more than 10 days off.

September 19th
September 30th
October 16th
October 29th
November 4th
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']The long and short of it is, all of these numbers are from eons ago, and the only thing that matters is how Andy feels tomorrow night.[/QUOTE]

Well, you're right about one thing. Those numbers are from a long time ago, which makes them a bit meaningless now. What matters is the fact that Andy is a 37 year old man who was hurt in the second half last year and who needed long rest the last two months.

There's a difference between giving up and realizing something bad is in the air. I'm not in the clubhouse, so it isn't like my attitude is gonna mean anything. If Derek Jeter was running around the clubhouse saying all the stuff I did, there would be a problem. I'm just telling you what everything looks like from the outside. And that's what it looks like. Joe could have been dealing from a position of strength and decided to try gamble everything.

Now, in all honesty, it's a bit unfair of me to lay all the blame on him. The front office is at fault, too. I was saying all summer that the Yankees needed to go out and get a LEGITIMATE forth starter. An innings eater. A guy who will always give you six or seven and give up three or four. Not a great pitcher, but not a bad one, either. It was absolutely silly that they went almost the second half of the year with Joba, Gaudin, and Mitre in the four and five sports. They were very, very, very, lucky the Sox never made a really legitimate run to get back into the division, or that fucked up rotation could have bit them in the ass. And in this series, if they had a real forth starter, this would have never been an issue.

Anyway, here's my best case scenario prediction for tonight. Yankees get to Pedro early with two in the first and chase him around the third with a couple of more runs and people still on. They get to that soft Phillie bullpen and keep adding on. Andy does a circus act through five, gives up four or five. The middle relief somehow gets 5 more outs, gets into trouble in the seventh, and Mo records a seven-out save on 35 pitches.

EDIT: And obviously, judging by my prediction, I share in the opinion that Pedro's Game 2 performance was a lot of smoke and mirrors. The Yankees got a good look at him that night, and I think they will have a much better approach going into this game. I would not be surprised to see a lot of first pitches put into play really hard.
 
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I totally get what you're saying, Bruce. And Andy being 37 is a concern. But I don't think that means the Phillies have some kind of huge advantage. Pedro, himself, is 38. So, yeah...he's got one more day of rest, but there's no guarantee he's going to be lights out. For all we know, both pitchers could be out by the 3rd inning and we might be seeing JA Happ vs Chad Gaudin. If I was going to make any assumption about tonight, it would be that it's going to take a lot of runs to win the game...for both teams. I also wouldn't be surprised to see Teixeira just go off tonight. Let's call his line 3-5, 1 2B, 1 HR, 4 RBI. Go Yanks! :)
 
Meant to get back here sooner.

[quote name='n8rockerasu']But now it sounds like you're arguing for umpire consistency, which I don't think anybody would disagree with. If an umpire's strikezone is all over the place, that's bullshit. But if he's consistently calling the outside strike all night and the pitcher and hitter don't adjust to it, then they're just dumb.[/quote]
But that doesn't answer the question of why batters and pitchers have to "find" the zone 162 times a year.
Consistency is the most important factor. Once you learn what the umpire is calling, it's up to you what you do with it.
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If consistency is the most important factor, why do we idolize inconsistency?
[quote name='bigdaddybruce44']Again, getting lucky and catching breaks is a part of sports. Is it fair that a team has a speedy runner on first, hits a ball into the corner, and some douche bag fan touches the ball? Or the ball bounces into the seats for a ground rule double, and the runner has to hold, even though he would have almost certainly scored? Or a batter hits a frozen rope right a fielder? Or a pitcher shatters a bat, but the ball flops in between an infielder and outfielder? Those things have little or nothing to do with skill, and a whole lot to do with luck. The same holds true of an umpire making a bad call or having a large or small strike zone. It's part of the game.[/quote]
The difference is that the rule book says what must happen in every circumstance. There is no true "variation" in the other examples because everyone knows the rules ahead of time. The thing is, everyone knows the rules of the strike zone as well but in this instance, we choose not to uniformly apply the rules.
If you don't like the subjectivity that comes with officiating, you must also hate watching hockey, football, and basketball, because more subjectivity comes into play with those sports.
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Those sports have a timing clock. Sports with timers are not the same as those without. Those without are meticulously scored because there's no hurry to beat the clock and ref decisions aren't required in real time (in most cases). With timers requires snap decisions that stop the clock and flow of play and that introduces variance. There is no baseball equivalent to the stoppage of play because of an offsides or over the back.
Outside of the strike zone, everything else in baseball is pretty clear cut.
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So why is that ok?
That obviously sounds silly, but so does the idea of having a machine call balls and strikes to almost all baseball fans.
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I absolutely agree and I'm not saying it doesn't rub the wrong way the 1st hundred times. I straight up laughed in the guy's face the first time someone mentioned it to me. How dare you attempt to screw with the strike zone! That's hallowed ground!
All I know is that I don't want machines umpiring a game. And again, I really doubt the vast majority of baseball fans want it, either. To be truthful, despite all of the bad umpiring, you're the first person this year I have heard even suggest it, especially considering the home plate umpiring has probably been the best aspects of most of these crews. Most games I have seen have been called very, very, very consistent, which as n8rockerasu pointed out is really the key.
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Here's my point: A strike should be a strike. A ball should be a ball. That's it.
 
I say stick a fork in the Phillies. This has gone exactly as I predicted (barring extremely bad luck). Yankees in 6. Couldn't be happier as I despise the phillies.
 
[quote name='bigdaddybruce44']Oh, boy. That was great.

Now, how nuts is that the World Series MVP likely will be in another uniform next year? Kind of unheard of.[/QUOTE]

Maybe that cements his stay in the Bronx and allows them to let Damon walk.

Kudos to the Yanks, as much as I hate to say it, for winning the World Series.
 
[quote name='craven_fiend']Maybe that cements his stay in the Bronx and allows them to let Damon walk.

Kudos to the Yanks, as much as I hate to say it, for winning the World Series.[/QUOTE]


yeah hats off to the Bronx.:applause:

hopefully in 10000000 years, Queens gets to have that feeling again :cold:
 
There are two reasons Damon has an edge. One, he also hit very well in the ALCS and WS. Two, Damon still has a little bit of athleticism in him. The Yankees are really not interested in a full-time DH. They wanna use the spot as a rotating day-off for A-Rod, Jeter, Posada, etc.
 
Ryan Howard is the new anti-clutch. Even his postgame reaction makes me hate him more (oh I don't feel too bad, we just got beat by a better team, etc). If they hadn't won last year that might be enough to run him out of town.

Pedro didn't have it today but the Phillies lost the series because of their bullpen, Howard not hitting, and their defense giving the Yankees extra outs throughout.
 
Ibanez, Rollins, Howard, Hamels, Lidge.....they didn't perform either. It was basically Utley, Lee, and Ruiz.


Hopefully MLB does something about the shitty umpires. Pipe dream....
 
[quote name='dafoomie']Ryan Howard is the new anti-clutch. Even his postgame reaction makes me hate him more (oh I don't feel too bad, we just got beat by a better team, etc). If they hadn't won last year that might be enough to run him out of town.

Pedro didn't have it today but the Phillies lost the series because of their bullpen, Howard not hitting, and their defense giving the Yankees extra outs throughout.[/QUOTE]

ryan howard has to have the worst plate discipline in the past decade. Its just as bad as Jim Thome or Mike Cameron. He justs looks so lost out there. I have no idea why the Phillies didnt work on him the past two seasons with his exorbitant strike out numbers.

I think it was pedro's job to keep the game close for the phillies. I think they were relying too much on utley to provide them the key hits that they needed. Once the Yankees silenced Utley's bat, this game was long over. but yeah i do agree too that the Bullpen blew the series wide open. Happ fizzeled, lidge became lidge, durbin, madson, etc all became ineffective...while guys like Marte and Coke were getting huge outs.

I guess Charlie got a bit of the Jerry disease witht the bullpen.
 
I think the biggest key that people are overlooking is Hamels. He had a 3-0 lead. If he could have just pitched decently and gave them a better chance to win Game 3, that whole series would have turned.

But yeah, I don't see Howard much, but I gotta believe this is more than just a simple slump. He looked awful. Then again, there are plenty of times when I say the same thing about A-Rod and Tex (who actually did look awful, too). But the Yankees really did basically do the same thing over and over and over again, and the big man never caught on.
 
Just making my rounds to puff out my chest and say I was right, lol ;) I told you, man. Andy Pettitte. Not the same pitcher as weak minded AJ Burnett. I didn't want to say this before because it would have made me looked blatantly biased, but Andy is my favorite pitcher of all time. I've followed him since he was in AAA, and he's just always been a gamer. He doesn't give up and he battles. What an incredible feeling to see him close out all 3 playoff series.

Tonight truly was a perfect ending to the season. Back in the Bronx, Pettitte doing his thing, Jeter getting hits, Matsui having the game of his life, and Mo slamming the door like only Mo can. It's just too bad Posada was miserable tonight. But all in all a fantastic feeling to see the "old guard" get one more hurrah. And it's too bad Mussina didn't stick around for this. I guess he's the new Mattingly.

And it's also nice to see A-Rod finally get a ring. There's no question that he earned it this year. And if I'm not mistaken, I think that should finally "make him a Yankee". No more booing in his home park, and no more questions of him not being able to perform in the clutch (but I guess those fall on Teixeira and Cano now).

The Phillies put up a good fight, but Pedro got spanked hard tonight. I'm really glad Utley didn't break Reggie Jackson's record either. That would have pissed me off. It was also nice to see him stranded in the on-deck circle as the game ended. Oh, also, slickkill, you can't forget Jayson Werth. He had a pretty decent series as well.

But yeah, the Phils essentially had no pitching after Lee, and lost every game that he didn't start. So, that really says something. Great game tonight! And great showing by the Yanks in this Series! I'm just glad I didn't give up on them. :)
 
WE are the champions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's sad to think that baseball is done til Mid February when pitchers and catchers report.
 
[quote name='wildcpac']WE are the champions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's sad to think that baseball is done til Mid February when pitchers and catchers report.[/QUOTE]

Oh i am DAM happy that baseball is done. The nightmare is over for me.
 
[quote name='integralsmatic']Oh i am DAM happy that baseball is done. The nightmare is over for me.[/QUOTE]


Nightmare? I was in heaven all year. I like baseball when both teams are doing well. A good Mets is better for the local economy. It's just funny that the Yankees have one of their best season when the Mets have maybe their third worst. 62 and 93 take the cake.
 
[quote name='wildcpac']WE are the champions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's sad to think that baseball is done til Mid February when pitchers and catchers report.[/QUOTE]

Well, I'm if you have MLB Network, you'll probably see some Arizona Fall League, which has something on Saturday I believe. I imagine the Caribbean World Series and some Mexican League stuff as well.

But this is honestly the worst part of the sports year for me. I mean don't get me wrong, football is great but that's 2 or so days a week. I can't wait until December when there is literally a game a day in the NCAA.
 
[quote name='wildcpac']Nightmare? I was in heaven all year. I like baseball when both teams are doing well. A good Mets is better for the local economy. It's just funny that the Yankees have one of their best season when the Mets have maybe their third worst. 62 and 93 take the cake.[/QUOTE]

agreed on all accounts. this year is the second worst team money could buy.

oh yeah how could i forget the 93 season. I felt like this was the same kind of season minus the idiocy that coleman and saberhagen brought to the team. those two basically destroyed the whole club house. If people do not know what we are talking about, the 93 mets brought shame to queens as the worst team money could buy. Coleman hit Gooden with a golf club injuring his shoulder, reporters were tortured giving us more bad press, Anthony Young starting 0-13 and we lost 103 games because of it. just as forgetfull as the mets inaugural season in 62.
 
Yes, at least us baseball fans have the MLB Network for this entire offseason this year. They are suppose to have a lot of new programming. I am sure they are looking to stay strong, this being their first full offseason on the air. They don't wanna completely bomb.
 
Aside from Cliff Lee and C.C.'s dominating performances in the postseason, this was really a hitter's postseason. I'm kinda surprised we didn't see lower scores. The teams in it were all heavy hitters, but it seemed like pitching would get it done.
 
[quote name='integralsmatic']agreed on all accounts. this year is the second worst team money could buy.

oh yeah how could i forget the 93 season. I felt like this was the same kind of season minus the idiocy that coleman and saberhagen brought to the team. those two basically destroyed the whole club house. If people do not know what we are talking about, the 93 mets brought shame to queens as the worst team money could buy. Coleman hit Gooden with a golf club injuring his shoulder, reporters were tortured giving us more bad press, Anthony Young starting 0-13 and we lost 103 games because of it. just as forgetfull as the mets inaugural season in 62.[/QUOTE]

Don't forget about the firecracker incident.
 
Now is the winter of my discontent (yes, I know I'm mis-applying the quote).

As a Red Sox fan, there is nothing more depressing than an offseason following a Yankees title. They were definitely the best team this year, so they deserved it, but the FOUR Yankees jerseys I've already seen in my office today have me gearing up for a loooong winter.
 
[quote name='bigdaddybruce44']But yeah, I don't see Howard much, but I gotta believe this is more than just a simple slump. He looked awful. Then again, there are plenty of times when I say the same thing about A-Rod and Tex (who actually did look awful, too). But the Yankees really did basically do the same thing over and over and over again, and the big man never caught on.[/QUOTE]

I'd like to say that I view this as a simple slump. He has been very good in the postseason until the WS. He's also been much better in the regular season than last year. He did only cut his strikeouts by 13 from last season, but he pulled his average up from .251 to .279. I'm in no way a huge Ryan Howard fan, Utley all the way, but I must say he did improve himself this year. It is kind of amazing his average fell so much from 06 when he batted .313 and won the NL MVP. The thing about the Phillies is generally when 1 or 2 players slump, the rest of the team really picks it up. That just didn't happen in the WS. See ya next year.
 
[quote name='pitfallharry219']Don't forget about the firecracker incident.[/QUOTE]


Or Bobby Bonilla telling the news reporter that he Bonilla would show him some parts of the Bronx.
 
[quote name='bvharris']Now is the winter of my discontent (yes, I know I'm mis-applying the quote).

As a Red Sox fan, there is nothing more depressing than an offseason following a Yankees title. They were definitely the best team this year, so they deserved it, but the FOUR Yankees jerseys I've already seen in my office today have me gearing up for a loooong winter.[/QUOTE]

Not that I'm a fan of bandwagoners, but payback is a bitch. I take it you didn't celebrate in 2004 and 2007?
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']Not that I'm a fan of bandwagoners, but payback is a bitch. I take it you didn't celebrate in 2004 and 2007?[/QUOTE]


2004 and 2007 never happened. Man Ram and Big Poopi cheating erased history.
 
[quote name='wildcpac']Or Bobby Bonilla telling the news reporter that he Bonilla would show him some parts of the Bronx.[/QUOTE]

Ahhh ... the memories. Jeff Torborg we hardly knew ya!
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']Not that I'm a fan of bandwagoners, but payback is a bitch. I take it you didn't celebrate in 2004 and 2007?[/QUOTE]

Of course I did. :D I'm not begrudging Yankees fans their title, they have a right to be happy and boast. I wouldn't be much of a fan if seeing the bitter rival celebrate a title didn't depress me though, would I?

[quote name='wildcpac']2004 and 2007 never happened. Man Ram and Big Poopi cheating erased history.[/QUOTE]

Uh huh, and there's no users on this Yankees team.
 
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