2009-2010 NBA Thread
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speedracer
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2nd half Celts look like 1st game Celts. Flat, nobody being aggressive, missing wide open shots. Pierce needs to remember he's a good player.
speedracer
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Cue the Celtics fans complaining about the refs after Kobe "pushing" Rondo.
speedracer
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And the Celts fans complaining about the refs has gone completely silent. Can't imagine why.
speedracer
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Yea. Big foul there. Puts Rondo on the line, 5th foul for Artest, and he didn't touch him.
[quote name='speedracer']Yea. Big foul there. Puts Rondo on the line, 5th foul for Artest, and he didn't touch him.[/QUOTE]
6th? I think he just fouled out.
Edit: Yeah, 6th. That was a bad call. I'm a C's fan, and I gotta say, that was an awful call.
6th? I think he just fouled out.
Edit: Yeah, 6th. That was a bad call. I'm a C's fan, and I gotta say, that was an awful call.
BigSpoonyBard
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There were weak calls all over, but that out of bounds call that wasn't reversed? That was criminal. Clearly off Garnett. Still, the Lakers lost because they played a shitty 4th quarter, not because of the refs. No ball movement at all. They scored at will when they were running a Kobe-Bynum pick and roll. Not one pick and roll in the 4th. They just sucked over the last 6 minutes, plain and simple.
[quote name='speedracer']Yea. Big foul there. Puts Rondo on the line, 5th foul for Artest, and he didn't touch him.[/QUOTE]
I agree it shouldn't have been called in that spot, but he obviously did touch him. I don't think it was enough contact to necessitate a foul, but to say Artest didn't touch him is just incorrect. At game speed I thought there was a chance he hooked the arm, which is obviously what the refs saw. On replays it didn't look that way, but it was hardly the most egregious call of all time.
I'm a little surprised the Celtics still won this game getting nothing from KG and Pierce. Ray Allen's ridiculous half was ultimately rendered moot by the 3rd, so the game was really won when Rondo took over down the stretch. He was everywhere, as he is wont to do.
As a C's fan, definitely happy with a split.
I agree it shouldn't have been called in that spot, but he obviously did touch him. I don't think it was enough contact to necessitate a foul, but to say Artest didn't touch him is just incorrect. At game speed I thought there was a chance he hooked the arm, which is obviously what the refs saw. On replays it didn't look that way, but it was hardly the most egregious call of all time.
I'm a little surprised the Celtics still won this game getting nothing from KG and Pierce. Ray Allen's ridiculous half was ultimately rendered moot by the 3rd, so the game was really won when Rondo took over down the stretch. He was everywhere, as he is wont to do.
As a C's fan, definitely happy with a split.
[quote name='BigSpoonyBard']There were weak calls all over, but that out of bounds call that wasn't reversed? That was criminal. Clearly off Garnett. Still, the Lakers lost because they played a shitty 4th quarter, not because of the refs. No ball movement at all. They scored at will when they were running a Kobe-Bynum pick and roll. Not one pick and roll in the 4th. They just sucked over the last 6 minutes, plain and simple.[/QUOTE]
The only defense I can see. Is some refs think that if you are pushing on someones hand and cause the ball to go out then it is out on you. Regardless it was pretty bad call
41-26 FT advantage in the Lakers favor and their fans are complaining about the refs? Both teams were equally aggressive going to the rim. hell its worst when you take out the 6-8 shots at the end because of the intentional calls
Oh did kobe get taken out of the game becaus eof questionable fouls? Sounds kind of like ray allen's game one.
The refs will try to do better next time and just eject two or three Celtics
I"m happy about the win but god the C's have to rebound better. Can't depend on our PG to be our leading rebounder every night
The only defense I can see. Is some refs think that if you are pushing on someones hand and cause the ball to go out then it is out on you. Regardless it was pretty bad call
41-26 FT advantage in the Lakers favor and their fans are complaining about the refs? Both teams were equally aggressive going to the rim. hell its worst when you take out the 6-8 shots at the end because of the intentional calls
Oh did kobe get taken out of the game becaus eof questionable fouls? Sounds kind of like ray allen's game one.
The refs will try to do better next time and just eject two or three Celtics
I"m happy about the win but god the C's have to rebound better. Can't depend on our PG to be our leading rebounder every night
Dr. Phil didn't hesitate to complain about the refs, about Odom's 2 quick fouls (though not KG's 2 quicker fouls) and about Fisher not being allowed to bearhug Allen off the ball after the first half.
Phil, you had 41 free throws! The Celtics only had 26 after a bunch of intentional fouls in the last few minutes. It was 35-13 in the 3rd. The Lakers went to the line every time they went in the paint and all of the Celtics bigs were in foul trouble the entire night down to their last one on the bench. He always postures in his press conference after a loss and complains about the refs no matter what actually happened.
They tried to bait Kobe into blaming the refs but he took the high road.
What happened is that the Lakers took away Ray Allen in the 2nd half, and the Celtics took away Gasol in the 4th. Gasol had one point in the 4th quarter, and (I believe) didn't attempt a shot, at least not before garbage time.
Phil, you had 41 free throws! The Celtics only had 26 after a bunch of intentional fouls in the last few minutes. It was 35-13 in the 3rd. The Lakers went to the line every time they went in the paint and all of the Celtics bigs were in foul trouble the entire night down to their last one on the bench. He always postures in his press conference after a loss and complains about the refs no matter what actually happened.
They tried to bait Kobe into blaming the refs but he took the high road.
What happened is that the Lakers took away Ray Allen in the 2nd half, and the Celtics took away Gasol in the 4th. Gasol had one point in the 4th quarter, and (I believe) didn't attempt a shot, at least not before garbage time.
thamaster24
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[quote name='dafoomie']
What happened is that the Lakers took away Ray Allen in the 2nd half, and the Celtics took away Gasol in the 4th. Gasol had one point in the 4th quarter, and (I believe) didn't attempt a shot, at least not before garbage time.[/QUOTE]
rayray still fought hard around screens and made his defender work really hard the entire 2nd half even if he didn't score much. Also even though Pau didn't do much in the 4th I think they went with a Bynum-Odom combo til like 5 mins left, I could be remembering that wrong though.
Everyone on both sides has room to complain about the officiating in the game as others have said already, this was some of the shittiest officiating I've ever seen.
If I'm the Lakers I'm worried about the ball movement, especially when Kobe's not in
If I'm the Celtics I'm worried about what KG ate before the game... seriously WTF KG and PP this game
What happened is that the Lakers took away Ray Allen in the 2nd half, and the Celtics took away Gasol in the 4th. Gasol had one point in the 4th quarter, and (I believe) didn't attempt a shot, at least not before garbage time.[/QUOTE]
rayray still fought hard around screens and made his defender work really hard the entire 2nd half even if he didn't score much. Also even though Pau didn't do much in the 4th I think they went with a Bynum-Odom combo til like 5 mins left, I could be remembering that wrong though.
Everyone on both sides has room to complain about the officiating in the game as others have said already, this was some of the shittiest officiating I've ever seen.
If I'm the Lakers I'm worried about the ball movement, especially when Kobe's not in
If I'm the Celtics I'm worried about what KG ate before the game... seriously WTF KG and PP this game
The refs had way too much influence in this game. Random calls left and right that shifted the game's momentum just when one team got something going. Game was seriously a bore to watch as well with a lot of the superstars sitting out in foul trouble.
I really hope they ease up a bit more in the upcoming games. A few shitty calls throughout the game is okay, but a few per quarter is unacceptable.
I really hope they ease up a bit more in the upcoming games. A few shitty calls throughout the game is okay, but a few per quarter is unacceptable.
[quote name='jlarlee']
I"m happy about the win but god the C's have to rebound better. Can't depend on our PG to be our leading rebounder every night[/QUOTE]
I know it doesn't seem like it, but the C's actually won the boards 44-39. Obviously there's more to it than just the straight up rebound battle, but given that I'd consider the Lakers to be a better rebounding team overall, I'd call this a win, especially after Game 1.
I"m happy about the win but god the C's have to rebound better. Can't depend on our PG to be our leading rebounder every night[/QUOTE]
I know it doesn't seem like it, but the C's actually won the boards 44-39. Obviously there's more to it than just the straight up rebound battle, but given that I'd consider the Lakers to be a better rebounding team overall, I'd call this a win, especially after Game 1.
[quote name='speedracer']There's been a lot of contact in this game. Shit man, watch the war under the rim.
All that, ALL THAT, and the lead is 6 at halftime. Looks like the Celtics are going to need to break Finals records just to win a game in this series.[/QUOTE]
All that? No KG and no Pierce basically. Sure Allen was great, but it's not like the C's had some amazing record breaking performance... Lakers had a NBA Finals shot blocking record... Hmm... Kind of makes you wonder what could've happened had Allen not got
ed in game 1.
[quote name='wildcpac']Lakers take the lead already. Lakers have swung the game from a 14 points down to a 1 point lead in like 4 minutes.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.[/QUOTE]
Someone spoke too soon.
[quote name='speedracer']Cue the Celtics fans complaining about the refs after Kobe "pushing" Rondo.[/QUOTE]
Nah that's nothing to complain about. What is to complain about if you want to know is that 95% of the time the Celtics had a clean block or the Lakers got close to the rim, a foul was called. The Celtics had to draw a lot of fouls. The Lakers got their fouls handed to them just by putting the ball up to the hoop. The fouls called on the Lakers were mostly just non-shooting fouls. Lakers had 41 free throws... 15 more than the Celtics. All of our bigs were in foul trouble all game. And yet the Lakers fans are complaining and I'm wrong for complaining about the calls in the first game! And another thing, the Celtics are a physical team, this type of referring favors the Lakers because it hurts the Celtics more.
[quote name='wildcpac']Lakers geted over hard by the Refs. Cry some more about fouls Celtics fans. Lakers got ed big time.[/QUOTE] 
[quote name='jlarlee']
41-26 FT advantage in the Lakers favor and their fans are complaining about the refs? Both teams were equally aggressive going to the rim. hell its worst when you take out the 6-8 shots at the end because of the intentional calls
[/QUOTE]
[quote name='wildcpac']Turning point so far in the 3rd is the bitch flop by Rondo to get Kobe's "4th" foul. Too bad Rondo didn't re injure his back on that dive.[/QUOTE]
Haven't seen any Celtics fans here hope for a Lakers player to get injured...
[quote name='Soodmeg']Wow things are going exactly as planned in the series. Glad I am not watching it. You know what the Cs are getting their ass kicked? Because the EAST is the biggest joke in all of sports. When half of the play off bound teams are either at .500 or have a losing record its easy to coast through to the finals only having to beat 1 or 2 other good teams.
The lakers even though I hate them at least have to battle every game to get to where they are. There are very few teams in the West that you can sleep on for a 7 game series. (for the love of god change this back to the 3-5-7 format)
Now, I will comment on the flops. Lets take out people whos only role in the game is to pick up fouls for the other team (Davis is one of these guys) because frankly thats their job.
Paul Perice has got to be one of the worst actors in the league. The guy is always down on the ground for 2 min plus, he is the master of the pussy pump fake and then flail your body into the defender. Although I respect his toughness and his ability to lead his team I hate watching him play. I put him in the same boat as pussy ass bitch master Manu Ginflopi.
Also, Paul Gasol is not just good because of his height. He was a borderline superstar his entire career in Memphis, the only thing that is different is he has a team around him that doesnt completely suck.
Stern needs to get off his ass and look at what his league has become and understand that some big changes are needed to get the NBA competitive.[/QUOTE]
Celtics had a tougher road to the finals. The West only has 2 more teams above .500 then the East. But ya let's keep making comparisons between different conferences... And record means everything, that's why the Celtics are the finals right? Half did not have .500 or losing record, 1 team was at .500, all the others were above. And what pressure is there on East teams to care about record more than other things like health, when they're competing in their league for a spot, not competing with the West for a spot? Other than home court advantage in the finals, I'd worry about other stuff more than what team I'll face in the finals and trying to get the better record. Look at the differential between the West playoff teams in terms of games ahead/behind, they're all nearly the same or off by 1-2 games. They have more reason to put record ahead of other concerns near the end of the season.
Lakers battled these playoffs and the Celtics did not? C'mon man.
Paul Gasol makes his shots because he's so tall he has no hand in his face. The rest of the time he throws in 4 footers and grabs rebounds, again because he's tall. If you love bigs then by all means think they're great, but I definitely see the kind of stuff players like Rondo, Allen, Kobe, & Pierce do as much more impressive.
All that, ALL THAT, and the lead is 6 at halftime. Looks like the Celtics are going to need to break Finals records just to win a game in this series.[/QUOTE]
All that? No KG and no Pierce basically. Sure Allen was great, but it's not like the C's had some amazing record breaking performance... Lakers had a NBA Finals shot blocking record... Hmm... Kind of makes you wonder what could've happened had Allen not got
ed in game 1.[quote name='wildcpac']Lakers take the lead already. Lakers have swung the game from a 14 points down to a 1 point lead in like 4 minutes.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.[/QUOTE]
Someone spoke too soon.
[quote name='speedracer']Cue the Celtics fans complaining about the refs after Kobe "pushing" Rondo.[/QUOTE]
Nah that's nothing to complain about. What is to complain about if you want to know is that 95% of the time the Celtics had a clean block or the Lakers got close to the rim, a foul was called. The Celtics had to draw a lot of fouls. The Lakers got their fouls handed to them just by putting the ball up to the hoop. The fouls called on the Lakers were mostly just non-shooting fouls. Lakers had 41 free throws... 15 more than the Celtics. All of our bigs were in foul trouble all game. And yet the Lakers fans are complaining and I'm wrong for complaining about the calls in the first game! And another thing, the Celtics are a physical team, this type of referring favors the Lakers because it hurts the Celtics more.
[quote name='wildcpac']Lakers get
ed over hard by the Refs. Cry some more about fouls Celtics fans. Lakers got ed big time.[/QUOTE] [quote name='jlarlee']
41-26 FT advantage in the Lakers favor and their fans are complaining about the refs? Both teams were equally aggressive going to the rim. hell its worst when you take out the 6-8 shots at the end because of the intentional calls
[/QUOTE]
[quote name='wildcpac']Turning point so far in the 3rd is the bitch flop by Rondo to get Kobe's "4th" foul. Too bad Rondo didn't re injure his back on that dive.[/QUOTE]
Haven't seen any Celtics fans here hope for a Lakers player to get injured...
[quote name='Soodmeg']Wow things are going exactly as planned in the series. Glad I am not watching it. You know what the Cs are getting their ass kicked? Because the EAST is the biggest joke in all of sports. When half of the play off bound teams are either at .500 or have a losing record its easy to coast through to the finals only having to beat 1 or 2 other good teams.
The lakers even though I hate them at least have to battle every game to get to where they are. There are very few teams in the West that you can sleep on for a 7 game series. (for the love of god change this back to the 3-5-7 format)
Now, I will comment on the flops. Lets take out people whos only role in the game is to pick up fouls for the other team (Davis is one of these guys) because frankly thats their job.
Paul Perice has got to be one of the worst actors in the league. The guy is always down on the ground for 2 min plus, he is the master of the pussy pump fake and then flail your body into the defender. Although I respect his toughness and his ability to lead his team I hate watching him play. I put him in the same boat as pussy ass bitch master Manu Ginflopi.
Also, Paul Gasol is not just good because of his height. He was a borderline superstar his entire career in Memphis, the only thing that is different is he has a team around him that doesnt completely suck.
Stern needs to get off his ass and look at what his league has become and understand that some big changes are needed to get the NBA competitive.[/QUOTE]
Celtics had a tougher road to the finals. The West only has 2 more teams above .500 then the East. But ya let's keep making comparisons between different conferences... And record means everything, that's why the Celtics are the finals right? Half did not have .500 or losing record, 1 team was at .500, all the others were above. And what pressure is there on East teams to care about record more than other things like health, when they're competing in their league for a spot, not competing with the West for a spot? Other than home court advantage in the finals, I'd worry about other stuff more than what team I'll face in the finals and trying to get the better record. Look at the differential between the West playoff teams in terms of games ahead/behind, they're all nearly the same or off by 1-2 games. They have more reason to put record ahead of other concerns near the end of the season.
Lakers battled these playoffs and the Celtics did not? C'mon man.
Paul Gasol makes his shots because he's so tall he has no hand in his face. The rest of the time he throws in 4 footers and grabs rebounds, again because he's tall. If you love bigs then by all means think they're great, but I definitely see the kind of stuff players like Rondo, Allen, Kobe, & Pierce do as much more impressive.
[quote name='bvharris']I know it doesn't seem like it, but the C's actually won the boards 44-39. Obviously there's more to it than just the straight up rebound battle, but given that I'd consider the Lakers to be a better rebounding team overall, I'd call this a win, especially after Game 1.[/QUOTE]
Might have been increased a bit by big baby grabbing like 6 of them in that one play. I just saw why too many second chance points by the Lakers
Might have been increased a bit by big baby grabbing like 6 of them in that one play. I just saw why too many second chance points by the Lakers
thamaster24
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[quote name='J7.']
Paul Gasol makes his shots because he's so tall he has no hand in his face. The rest of the time he throws in 4 footers and grabs rebounds, again because he's tall. If you love bigs then by all means think they're great, but I definitely see the kind of stuff players like Rondo, Allen, Kobe, & Pierce do as much more impressive.[/QUOTE]
You make it sound so easy
Paul Gasol makes his shots because he's so tall he has no hand in his face. The rest of the time he throws in 4 footers and grabs rebounds, again because he's tall. If you love bigs then by all means think they're great, but I definitely see the kind of stuff players like Rondo, Allen, Kobe, & Pierce do as much more impressive.[/QUOTE]
You make it sound so easy
Gentlegamer
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Ray Allen broke Kenny Smith's Finals three pointers record! Congrats!
soulvengeance
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[quote name='J7.']
Paul Gasol makes his shots because he's so tall he has no hand in his face. The rest of the time he throws in 4 footers and grabs rebounds, again because he's tall. If you love bigs then by all means think they're great, but I definitely see the kind of stuff players like Rondo, Allen, Kobe, & Pierce do as much more impressive.[/QUOTE]
Well, by your standards, Manute Bol should've been a monster then, as well as Shawn Bradley.
Paul Gasol makes his shots because he's so tall he has no hand in his face. The rest of the time he throws in 4 footers and grabs rebounds, again because he's tall. If you love bigs then by all means think they're great, but I definitely see the kind of stuff players like Rondo, Allen, Kobe, & Pierce do as much more impressive.[/QUOTE]
Well, by your standards, Manute Bol should've been a monster then, as well as Shawn Bradley.
[quote name='docvinh']Well, by your standards, Manute Bol should've been a monster then, as well as Shawn Bradley.[/QUOTE]
This guy? http://bucketnotes.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/tmac-on-bradley.jpg
He TOTALLY was! Hahahaha.
This guy? http://bucketnotes.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/tmac-on-bradley.jpg
He TOTALLY was! Hahahaha.
J7. lost all credibility on basketball after claiming Pau is only good because he's TALL.
Way to go, dingus.
Pau is easily a TOP 3 power forward. Dude has an incredible combination of speed, power, and finesse. He can post you up, hit that jumper, and take you to the hole--YOUR BUTTHOLE if he damn well wanted to.
Way to go, dingus.
Pau is easily a TOP 3 power forward. Dude has an incredible combination of speed, power, and finesse. He can post you up, hit that jumper, and take you to the hole--YOUR BUTTHOLE if he damn well wanted to.
[quote name='docvinh']Well, by your standards, Manute Bol should've been a monster then, as well as Shawn Bradley.[/QUOTE]
Sure Gasol has talent, but nowhere near the talent of other players (not referring to bigs). It's a lot harder to do what smaller players do then what a big tall goofy horse looking dude has to do to be good. Where's his jockey? Here he is running
with his jockey 
on top.
Sure Gasol has talent, but nowhere near the talent of other players (not referring to bigs). It's a lot harder to do what smaller players do then what a big tall goofy horse looking dude has to do to be good. Where's his jockey? Here he is running
with his jockey on top.[quote name='mis0']J7. lost all credibility on basketball after claiming Pau is only good because he's TALL.
Way to go, dingus.
Pau is easily a TOP 3 power forward. Dude has an incredible combination of speed, power, and finesse. He can post you up, hit that jumper, and take you to the hole--YOUR BUTTHOLE if he damn well wanted to.[/QUOTE]
He has talent yes. And is easily one of the best bigs in the game. Do I think that means he is great? No. I don't think bigs are anything special unless they're pulling down 20 boards a game or scoring 30 a game consistently. You want bigs talent? Give me Bill Russel, Wilt Chamberlain, etc
Way to go, dingus.
Pau is easily a TOP 3 power forward. Dude has an incredible combination of speed, power, and finesse. He can post you up, hit that jumper, and take you to the hole--YOUR BUTTHOLE if he damn well wanted to.[/QUOTE]
He has talent yes. And is easily one of the best bigs in the game. Do I think that means he is great? No. I don't think bigs are anything special unless they're pulling down 20 boards a game or scoring 30 a game consistently. You want bigs talent? Give me Bill Russel, Wilt Chamberlain, etc
So by your logic, the smaller guys aren't as impressive because they aren't doing what the bigs do? (pulling down your 20 boards a game, etc.). And honestly, how many games did you watch Bill Russel and Wilt Chamberlain play?
Pau's a beast. Sorry if you don't like the way he does it. He's not gonna hit the pretty threes or drop a crossover and pull up on a fade away because that's not his job. That's the equivalent of saying a Tight End in football isn't as good as the Running Back because he doesn't get as many yards. They do the job their supposed to.
Pau's a beast. Sorry if you don't like the way he does it. He's not gonna hit the pretty threes or drop a crossover and pull up on a fade away because that's not his job. That's the equivalent of saying a Tight End in football isn't as good as the Running Back because he doesn't get as many yards. They do the job their supposed to.
KingBroly
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I'd like to know why Gasol only had no shots in the 4th. He had over 20 points in the game going into the 4th (which was tied at that point), so why didn't they feed him the ball in that situation? Seems like it'd be the best opportunity to give him the ball especially since he is the second best player on the team.
Oh, and Lakers fans can't complain about the officiating because they had 15 more free throws than the Celtics. Even if Kobe had 5 fouls, the Celtics had a couple with 5 as well.
Oh, and Lakers fans can't complain about the officiating because they had 15 more free throws than the Celtics. Even if Kobe had 5 fouls, the Celtics had a couple with 5 as well.
I know Artest had 5, but does anyone REALLY count him?
[quote name='KingBroly']
[/QUOTE]
Didn't he have the least amount of personal fouls of all of the Lakers starters through the season? I could swear I heard that during one playoff game. Whatever, not important. What IS important though is that Artest fouled out of the game.
I know Artest had 5, but does anyone REALLY count him?
Didn't he have the least amount of personal fouls of all of the Lakers starters through the season? I could swear I heard that during one playoff game. Whatever, not important. What IS important though is that Artest fouled out of the game.
speedracer
Banned
[quote name='KingBroly']Oh, and Lakers fans can't complain about the officiating because they had 15 more free throws than the Celtics. [/QUOTE]
During the 2nd and 3rd quarters, the Celtics completely stopped driving the lane. You don't get free throws when Pierce is clanking shit at the baseline.
During the 2nd and 3rd quarters, the Celtics completely stopped driving the lane. You don't get free throws when Pierce is clanking shit at the baseline.
lordopus99
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[quote name='J7.']
Paul Gasol makes his shots because he's so tall he has no hand in his face. The rest of the time he throws in 4 footers and grabs rebounds, again because he's tall. If you love bigs then by all means think they're great, but I definitely see the kind of stuff players like Rondo, Allen, Kobe, & Pierce do as much more impressive.[/QUOTE]
I am glad you enjoy watching people run over defensive players (i.e. Pierce and Kobe) instead of Bigs that can score at will without plowing over players in their wake. Or how exciting is it to watch Ray Allen run off two screen for an easy jumper... the boy can't create a shot himself.
[quote name='J7']He has talent yes. And is easily one of the best bigs in the game. Do I think that means he is great? No. I don't think bigs are anything special unless they're pulling down 20 boards a game or scoring 30 a game consistently. You want bigs talent? Give me Bill Russel, Wilt Chamberlain, etc [/QUOTE]
You got to be kidding me. First off, I doubt you ever saw Bill Russell or Wilt Chamberlain but if you did... you would notice that the guy guarding them/getting blocked were a lot smaller than them. Add into the fact that refs allowed more contact in that era. This is why their stats are inflated. Both of these guys were great players but if they had played in todays standards they wouldn't have looked as good playing.
[quote name='j7']Sure Gasol has talent, but nowhere near the talent of other players (not referring to bigs). It's a lot harder to do what smaller players do then what a big tall goofy horse looking dude has to do to be good.[/QUOTE]
It is just as hard being a big. First off, they have to keep up with the faster, smaller guards on switches. Second (outside Howard), the refs allowed the bigs to fight for position. If the smaller guys did it, it would be an auto foul i.e. hand checks. The bigs get bruised every night. Gasol has a good midrange jumper that is even lacking in a bunch of small player games i.e. Rondo.
The NBA has proven (since Jordan left) that the NBA is a guard league. All fouls favor a guard.
Paul Gasol makes his shots because he's so tall he has no hand in his face. The rest of the time he throws in 4 footers and grabs rebounds, again because he's tall. If you love bigs then by all means think they're great, but I definitely see the kind of stuff players like Rondo, Allen, Kobe, & Pierce do as much more impressive.[/QUOTE]
I am glad you enjoy watching people run over defensive players (i.e. Pierce and Kobe) instead of Bigs that can score at will without plowing over players in their wake. Or how exciting is it to watch Ray Allen run off two screen for an easy jumper... the boy can't create a shot himself. [quote name='J7']He has talent yes. And is easily one of the best bigs in the game. Do I think that means he is great? No. I don't think bigs are anything special unless they're pulling down 20 boards a game or scoring 30 a game consistently. You want bigs talent? Give me Bill Russel, Wilt Chamberlain, etc [/QUOTE]
You got to be kidding me. First off, I doubt you ever saw Bill Russell or Wilt Chamberlain but if you did... you would notice that the guy guarding them/getting blocked were a lot smaller than them. Add into the fact that refs allowed more contact in that era. This is why their stats are inflated. Both of these guys were great players but if they had played in todays standards they wouldn't have looked as good playing.
[quote name='j7']Sure Gasol has talent, but nowhere near the talent of other players (not referring to bigs). It's a lot harder to do what smaller players do then what a big tall goofy horse looking dude has to do to be good.[/QUOTE]
It is just as hard being a big. First off, they have to keep up with the faster, smaller guards on switches. Second (outside Howard), the refs allowed the bigs to fight for position. If the smaller guys did it, it would be an auto foul i.e. hand checks. The bigs get bruised every night. Gasol has a good midrange jumper that is even lacking in a bunch of small player games i.e. Rondo.
The NBA has proven (since Jordan left) that the NBA is a guard league. All fouls favor a guard.
[quote name='lordopus99']Or how exciting is it to watch Ray Allen run off two screen for an easy jumper... the boy can't create a shot himself. [/QUOTE]
Ray Allen pulls up for jump shots on dribble drives all the time, and he gets to the basket here and there. He did more of that with Seattle, but why would they ask him to do that here when they've got Paul Pierce?
If you can get Allen an open shot consistently with a couple of screens, why wouldn't you? He's eating Derek Fisher alive with his movement off the ball, and if Kobe tries to guard him he'll have to spend all his energy on defense.
[/QUOTE]Ray Allen pulls up for jump shots on dribble drives all the time, and he gets to the basket here and there. He did more of that with Seattle, but why would they ask him to do that here when they've got Paul Pierce?
If you can get Allen an open shot consistently with a couple of screens, why wouldn't you? He's eating Derek Fisher alive with his movement off the ball, and if Kobe tries to guard him he'll have to spend all his energy on defense.
Filbert
CAGiversary!
I've always thought that hitting a quick three after running around screens for half the shot clock is just as difficult as pull-up jumpers off the dribble. I always liked Ray Allen (that is until he elbowed Varejao in the crotch last season), but whatever you think of him you can't deny that he's a great shooter.
[quote name='Filbert'] I always liked Ray Allen (that is until he elbowed Varejao in the crotch last season), but whatever you think of him you can't deny that he's a great shooter.[/QUOTE]
I would think that anyone who wouldn't at least admit that Ray Allen is a great shooter hasn't been paying much attention to the NBA for the last 15 years.
I would think that anyone who wouldn't at least admit that Ray Allen is a great shooter hasn't been paying much attention to the NBA for the last 15 years.
Soodmeg
CAGiversary!
I cant even begin to comment on whatever the J7 is talking about. J7 you have stated all of the following.
1. Overall Team Record means nothing
2. Apparently you cant compare the East and the West
3.You also stated that teams in the East shouldnt care about winning more than other things including but not limited to health.
4.Also the fact that the West teams all have very close records they are less concerned toward the end of the season than East teams.
5.Gasol is only good because he is tall.
Lets break this down in order.
1. Overall team record means everything when comparing the East vs the West. When one conference entirely all of its play off teams winning 60% of their games (did you forget that these games are also played against East teams?) and the East has 3-4 teams a year that are under or at .500
2. Your reasoning for the inability to compare the East vs the West is because one apparently plays Lacrosse and the other Cricket? (What the hell are you talking about? You can compare any team in the NBA to one another because they play the same sport in the same league and consistently vs each other.)
3. Teams in the East dont care about winning? The? Isnt the point of sports, to win games? Are you suggesting that there is a strategy in losing close to 50% of your total games? Health? Yeah I am sure when your team starts the season off at 20-35 your number one concern is health. (Which is different from injuries because that is not what you are suggesting.)
4. The west teams are more worried about record. Yes that is true....because they dont suck ass.
5. I cant pick what joke to put here so I am just going to
J7 is talking about. J7 you have stated all of the following.1. Overall Team Record means nothing
2. Apparently you cant compare the East and the West
3.You also stated that teams in the East shouldnt care about winning more than other things including but not limited to health.
4.Also the fact that the West teams all have very close records they are less concerned toward the end of the season than East teams.
5.Gasol is only good because he is tall.
Lets break this down in order.
1. Overall team record means everything when comparing the East vs the West. When one conference entirely all of its play off teams winning 60% of their games (did you forget that these games are also played against East teams?) and the East has 3-4 teams a year that are under or at .500
2. Your reasoning for the inability to compare the East vs the West is because one apparently plays Lacrosse and the other Cricket? (What the hell are you talking about? You can compare any team in the NBA to one another because they play the same sport in the same league and consistently vs each other.)
3. Teams in the East dont care about winning? The
? Isnt the point of sports, to win games? Are you suggesting that there is a strategy in losing close to 50% of your total games? Health? Yeah I am sure when your team starts the season off at 20-35 your number one concern is health. (Which is different from injuries because that is not what you are suggesting.)4. The west teams are more worried about record. Yes that is true....because they dont suck ass.
5. I cant pick what joke to put here so I am just going to
[quote name='specialk']So by your logic, the smaller guys aren't as impressive because they aren't doing what the bigs do? (pulling down your 20 boards a game, etc.). And honestly, how many games did you watch Bill Russel and Wilt Chamberlain play?
Pau's a beast. Sorry if you don't like the way he does it. He's not gonna hit the pretty threes or drop a crossover and pull up on a fade away because that's not his job. That's the equivalent of saying a Tight End in football isn't as good as the Running Back because he doesn't get as many yards. They do the job their supposed to.[/QUOTE]
I did not imply that and I don't think you can reverse imply that. I said I'm not that impressed by most bigs. I think what the smaller guys do is much more impressive.
I've seen old footage of them, some of their stats, and what they accomplished. Not impressed by tight ends compared to running backs either. Ya they all do their job, I just don't see it all that special. More guys can do the same/close to same thing that the better bigs do in basketball or football, fewer guys can do close to same that the better smaller guys do.
[quote name='speedracer']During the 2nd and 3rd quarters, the Celtics completely stopped driving the lane. You don't get free throws when Pierce is clanking shit at the baseline.[/QUOTE]
Pierce only took 11 shots all game.
[quote name='lordopus99'] I am glad you enjoy watching people run over defensive players (i.e. Pierce and Kobe) instead of Bigs that can score at will without plowing over players in their wake. Or how exciting is it to watch Ray Allen run off two screen for an easy jumper... the boy can't create a shot himself. [/QUOTE]
You act like Pierce and Kobe only score because they run over players and that bigs don't do anything of that nature to score... Allen often pulls up for jumpers and makes them on his own. Most of his screens are for 3's. And if he runs without the ball so well, let him, don't force him to do it himself. Besides he opens the court for the other players after he runs off the screen, so they can roll and get the pass.
[quote name='lordopus99']You got to be kidding me. First off, I doubt you ever saw Bill Russell or Wilt Chamberlain but if you did... you would notice that the guy guarding them/getting blocked were a lot smaller than them. Add into the fact that refs allowed more contact in that era. This is why their stats are inflated. Both of these guys were great players but if they had played in todays standards they wouldn't have looked as good playing. [/QUOTE]
So you think Gasol is as good as Russel and Chamberlain? Show me all the small players that defended these guys and their heights. Russel was only 6'9''. They both have had 50+ rebound games. Why don't you adjust that for today's standards... is 40 low enough for you? What is Gasol's best in a game for comparison? You think their stats are inflated but you have no way of proving that.
[quote name='lordopus99']It is just as hard being a big. First off, they have to keep up with the faster, smaller guards on switches. Second (outside Howard), the refs allowed the bigs to fight for position. If the smaller guys did it, it would be an auto foul i.e. hand checks. The bigs get bruised every night. Gasol has a good midrange jumper that is even lacking in a bunch of small player games i.e. Rondo. [/QUOTE]
They don't usually keep up with the smaller guys on switches. The best they usually do is use their big body to block them, but usually the small guy blows past them if he doesn't suck. Rondo doesn't have the jumper, but he does so much other than that to win games. Big deal they get some bruises. As if that means anything.
The NBA has proven (since Jordan left) that the NBA is a guard league. All fouls favor a guard.[/QUOTE]
[quote name='Soodmeg']I cant even begin to comment on whatever the J7 is talking about. J7 you have stated all of the following.
1. Overall Team Record means nothing
2. Apparently you cant compare the East and the West
3.You also stated that teams in the East shouldnt care about winning more than other things including but not limited to health.
4.Also the fact that the West teams all have very close records they are less concerned toward the end of the season than East teams.
5.Gasol is only good because he is tall.
Lets break this down in order.
1. Overall team record means everything when comparing the East vs the West. When one conference entirely all of its play off teams winning 60% of their games (did you forget that these games are also played against East teams?) and the East has 3-4 teams a year that are under or at .500
2. Your reasoning for the inability to compare the East vs the West is because one apparently plays Lacrosse and the other Cricket? (What the hell are you talking about? You can compare any team in the NBA to one another because they play the same sport in the same league and consistently vs each other.)
3. Teams in the East dont care about winning? The? Isnt the point of sports, to win games? Are you suggesting that there is a strategy in losing close to 50% of your total games? Health? Yeah I am sure when your team starts the season off at 20-35 your number one concern is health. (Which is different from injuries because that is not what you are suggesting.)
4. The west teams are more worried about record. Yes that is true....because they dont suck ass.
5. I cant pick what joke to put here so I am just going to[/QUOTE]
I never said overall record means nothing. You're taking what I said and bringing it all the way to the furthest extreme. Throwinging words in my mouth. Juvenile way to debate something.
I said they shouldn't put their overall record above player health and other concerns, if they don't need to in order to make the playoffs. But again here you are taking it to the furthest extreme and making a mockery of what I actually did say.
I did noting say the West are less concerned at the end of the seasons, WTF is wrong with your comprehension. Either you're just changing what I said to be an ass or you read it so fast you didn't grasp it. I said the West teams had closer overall records to each other than the East teams near the end of the reg season, meaning that they care more about trying to get a better record above other concerns since it would have much bigger implications...
You can't make direct comparisons across conferences. Yes anyone who has seen 2 basketball games knows the conferences play each other. You cannot just compare conference to conference directly and come to the conclusion that one is better. Teams are primarily playing to win games against teams in their conference. They put more emphasis/effort/decision making on beating the teams in their conference.
Furthermore, teams play 52 games against teams in their conference and only 30 against teams in the opposing conference. So yes direct comparisons are completely valid!
Because you totally changed what I said, you did not comprehend what I actuallying said. I said:
And what pressure is there on East teams to care about record more than other things like health, when they're competing in their league for a spot, not competing with the West for a spot?
TRANSLATION: Teams A, B, C in Eastern Conference have already locked themselves into the playoffs with their current record. Team A, B, C does not go out of their way to bettering their record over other concerns when it is not likely they'll change their current seed.
Meanwhile Teams 1, 2, 3 have the same record in Western Conference so they fight harder for their record to try and be the 6th seed and not the 7th or 8th. Go back and look at the difference between the records of the teams in the Western Conference. They had more reason to put record ahead of other concerns near the end of the season.
Pau's a beast. Sorry if you don't like the way he does it. He's not gonna hit the pretty threes or drop a crossover and pull up on a fade away because that's not his job. That's the equivalent of saying a Tight End in football isn't as good as the Running Back because he doesn't get as many yards. They do the job their supposed to.[/QUOTE]
I did not imply that and I don't think you can reverse imply that. I said I'm not that impressed by most bigs. I think what the smaller guys do is much more impressive.
I've seen old footage of them, some of their stats, and what they accomplished. Not impressed by tight ends compared to running backs either. Ya they all do their job, I just don't see it all that special. More guys can do the same/close to same thing that the better bigs do in basketball or football, fewer guys can do close to same that the better smaller guys do.
[quote name='speedracer']During the 2nd and 3rd quarters, the Celtics completely stopped driving the lane. You don't get free throws when Pierce is clanking shit at the baseline.[/QUOTE]
Pierce only took 11 shots all game.
[quote name='lordopus99']
I am glad you enjoy watching people run over defensive players (i.e. Pierce and Kobe) instead of Bigs that can score at will without plowing over players in their wake. Or how exciting is it to watch Ray Allen run off two screen for an easy jumper... the boy can't create a shot himself. [/QUOTE]You act like Pierce and Kobe only score because they run over players and that bigs don't do anything of that nature to score... Allen often pulls up for jumpers and makes them on his own. Most of his screens are for 3's. And if he runs without the ball so well, let him, don't force him to do it himself. Besides he opens the court for the other players after he runs off the screen, so they can roll and get the pass.
[quote name='lordopus99']You got to be kidding me. First off, I doubt you ever saw Bill Russell or Wilt Chamberlain but if you did... you would notice that the guy guarding them/getting blocked were a lot smaller than them. Add into the fact that refs allowed more contact in that era. This is why their stats are inflated. Both of these guys were great players but if they had played in todays standards they wouldn't have looked as good playing. [/QUOTE]
So you think Gasol is as good as Russel and Chamberlain? Show me all the small players that defended these guys and their heights. Russel was only 6'9''. They both have had 50+ rebound games. Why don't you adjust that for today's standards... is 40 low enough for you? What is Gasol's best in a game for comparison? You think their stats are inflated but you have no way of proving that.
[quote name='lordopus99']It is just as hard being a big. First off, they have to keep up with the faster, smaller guards on switches. Second (outside Howard), the refs allowed the bigs to fight for position. If the smaller guys did it, it would be an auto foul i.e. hand checks. The bigs get bruised every night. Gasol has a good midrange jumper that is even lacking in a bunch of small player games i.e. Rondo. [/QUOTE]
They don't usually keep up with the smaller guys on switches. The best they usually do is use their big body to block them, but usually the small guy blows past them if he doesn't suck. Rondo doesn't have the jumper, but he does so much other than that to win games. Big deal they get some bruises. As if that means anything.
The NBA has proven (since Jordan left) that the NBA is a guard league. All fouls favor a guard.[/QUOTE]
[quote name='Soodmeg']I cant even begin to comment on whatever the
J7 is talking about. J7 you have stated all of the following.1. Overall Team Record means nothing
2. Apparently you cant compare the East and the West
3.You also stated that teams in the East shouldnt care about winning more than other things including but not limited to health.
4.Also the fact that the West teams all have very close records they are less concerned toward the end of the season than East teams.
5.Gasol is only good because he is tall.
Lets break this down in order.
1. Overall team record means everything when comparing the East vs the West. When one conference entirely all of its play off teams winning 60% of their games (did you forget that these games are also played against East teams?) and the East has 3-4 teams a year that are under or at .500
2. Your reasoning for the inability to compare the East vs the West is because one apparently plays Lacrosse and the other Cricket? (What the hell are you talking about? You can compare any team in the NBA to one another because they play the same sport in the same league and consistently vs each other.)
3. Teams in the East dont care about winning? The
? Isnt the point of sports, to win games? Are you suggesting that there is a strategy in losing close to 50% of your total games? Health? Yeah I am sure when your team starts the season off at 20-35 your number one concern is health. (Which is different from injuries because that is not what you are suggesting.)4. The west teams are more worried about record. Yes that is true....because they dont suck ass.
5. I cant pick what joke to put here so I am just going to
[/QUOTE]I never said overall record means nothing. You're taking what I said and bringing it all the way to the furthest extreme. Throwing
ing words in my mouth. Juvenile way to debate something.I said they shouldn't put their overall record above player health and other concerns, if they don't need to in order to make the playoffs. But again here you are taking it to the furthest extreme and making a mockery of what I actually did say.
I did not
ing say the West are less concerned at the end of the seasons, WTF is wrong with your comprehension. Either you're just changing what I said to be an ass or you read it so fast you didn't grasp it. I said the West teams had closer overall records to each other than the East teams near the end of the reg season, meaning that they care more about trying to get a better record above other concerns since it would have much bigger implications...You can't make direct comparisons across conferences. Yes anyone who has seen 2 basketball games knows the conferences play each other. You cannot just compare conference to conference directly and come to the conclusion that one is better. Teams are primarily playing to win games against teams in their conference. They put more emphasis/effort/decision making on beating the teams in their conference.
Furthermore, teams play 52 games against teams in their conference and only 30 against teams in the opposing conference. So yes direct comparisons are completely valid!
Because you totally changed what I said, you did not comprehend what I actually
ing said. I said:And what pressure is there on East teams to care about record more than other things like health, when they're competing in their league for a spot, not competing with the West for a spot?
TRANSLATION: Teams A, B, C in Eastern Conference have already locked themselves into the playoffs with their current record. Team A, B, C does not go out of their way to bettering their record over other concerns when it is not likely they'll change their current seed.
Meanwhile Teams 1, 2, 3 have the same record in Western Conference so they fight harder for their record to try and be the 6th seed and not the 7th or 8th. Go back and look at the difference between the records of the teams in the Western Conference. They had more reason to put record ahead of other concerns near the end of the season.
Soodmeg
CAGiversary!
Yeah...ok J7.
I am not going to get into anything with you. You have made little sense since you started posting. Once you said that Gasol was only good because he was tall it was pretty much over.
You seem to make claims and then quickly back track on everything. Why dont you trying just saying what you mean the first time instead of saying things like, "Gasol is only good because he is tall......no what I mean to say." "He is not as good as Bill Russell and Wilt.." Why the are we even comparing the two? Why did you even bring this up? You make claim that he isnt that great and then go back 15 decades for your comparison and you pick 2 people who were not even the same height. Wilt was 7-1 and Russell was 6-9. Gasol stands 7ft even. Where are you even going with this?
I get the feeling that your the type that has a complete thought in their head but half of it gets lost when you type it out.
I am not going to get into anything with you. You have made little sense since you started posting. Once you said that Gasol was only good because he was tall it was pretty much over.
You seem to make claims and then quickly back track on everything. Why dont you trying just saying what you mean the first time instead of saying things like, "Gasol is only good because he is tall......no what I mean to say." "He is not as good as Bill Russell and Wilt.." Why the
are we even comparing the two? Why did you even bring this up? You make claim that he isnt that great and then go back 15 decades for your comparison and you pick 2 people who were not even the same height. Wilt was 7-1 and Russell was 6-9. Gasol stands 7ft even. Where are you even going with this?I get the feeling that your the type that has a complete thought in their head but half of it gets lost when you type it out.
lordopus99
CAGiversary!
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[quote name='bvharris']I would think that anyone who wouldn't at least admit that Ray Allen is a great shooter hasn't been paying much attention to the NBA for the last 15 years. [/QUOTE]
I never said he wasn't a great shooter. I said he couldn't create his own shot. If Ray is open, he will bang it in every time. To me, him and JJ Redick are practically the same. Give JJ some screens and well just ask any ACC team what he does (the magic don't run screens... i am awaiting the day that Van Gundy gains some more knowledge of how to play offensively).
[quote name='J7']You act like Pierce and Kobe only score because they run over players and that bigs don't do anything of that nature to score... Allen often pulls up for jumpers and makes them on his own. Most of his screens are for 3's. And if he runs without the ball so well, let him, don't force him to do it himself. Besides he opens the court for the other players after he runs off the screen, so they can roll and get the pass. [/QUOTE]
2/3 of Pierces points come from running over/jumping into players i.e. running over players. Kobe Bryant on the other hand doesn't run over people as much as I made him out to be. As for Ray Allen, stop kidding yourself. The guy doesn't create his own jumper. I just watch a bunch of youtube clips just to make sure I mentioned it correctly; all proved my theory right. He either ran off screens or got a pass wide open from a driving player. I barely saw any clips where he actually drove on a player and created his own shot. In addition, I never said he wasn't a good mover off the ball but even still he isn't the best. As for the Open the Court comment, he doesn't do that; Pierce and Rondo do that for your team.
[quote name='J7']So you think Gasol is as good as Russel and Chamberlain? Show me all the small players that defended these guys and their heights. Russel was only 6'9''. They both have had 50+ rebound games. Why don't you adjust that for today's standards... is 40 low enough for you? What is Gasol's best in a game for comparison? You think their stats are inflated but you have no way of proving that.[/QUOTE]
The game today is different than what it was back then. Thus you can't compare one for one. I think Pau Gasol is one of the best current Power Forwards in the league.
Like I mentioned before, Wilt and Russell played in an era where most players were small (6'5ish)... in other words, they didn't have to compete for boards since most people were too small to out jump them. For instance, Wilt's 1962 team... the next tallest guy on roster that played good minutes was 6'6 Tom Meschery... the majority of the team was 6'4. Pau, for instance, plays on a roster with a 7'0 Andrew Bynum, 6'10 Lamar Odom... the majority of the team is 6'7. Again, Russell and Chamberlain stats are inflated. It's why Howard can't outrebound/outblock them and it's why Jordan/Kobe couldn't outscore them. Different game than it once was.
[quote name='J7']They don't usually keep up with the smaller guys on switches. The best they usually do is use their big body to block them, but usually the small guy blows past them if he doesn't suck. Rondo doesn't have the jumper, but he does so much other than that to win games. Big deal they get some bruises. As if that means anything.
[/QUOTE]
Are you sure about that?
Exhibit A: Dwight Howard... you said Ray Allen doesn't suck, yet around the 1:15 mark he got past Howard only to be swatting to the fourth row.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cxCfBs0yZo&feature=related
I could add other players if you want.
As for Rondo, he was example of a small guy who couldn't make jumpers. I never said he wasn't a good driver and passer. I personally like Rondo because he plays with a lot of passion which lacks in the majority of NBA players.
And bruises do affect... ask some of your fellow Celtics i.e. Rasheed Wallace's back, Big Baby's concussion, etc.
[/QUOTE]I never said he wasn't a great shooter. I said he couldn't create his own shot. If Ray is open, he will bang it in every time. To me, him and JJ Redick are practically the same. Give JJ some screens and well just ask any ACC team what he does (the magic don't run screens... i am awaiting the day that Van Gundy gains some more knowledge of how to play offensively).
[quote name='J7']You act like Pierce and Kobe only score because they run over players and that bigs don't do anything of that nature to score... Allen often pulls up for jumpers and makes them on his own. Most of his screens are for 3's. And if he runs without the ball so well, let him, don't force him to do it himself. Besides he opens the court for the other players after he runs off the screen, so they can roll and get the pass. [/QUOTE]
2/3 of Pierces points come from running over/jumping into players i.e. running over players. Kobe Bryant on the other hand doesn't run over people as much as I made him out to be. As for Ray Allen, stop kidding yourself. The guy doesn't create his own jumper. I just watch a bunch of youtube clips just to make sure I mentioned it correctly; all proved my theory right. He either ran off screens or got a pass wide open from a driving player. I barely saw any clips where he actually drove on a player and created his own shot. In addition, I never said he wasn't a good mover off the ball but even still he isn't the best. As for the Open the Court comment, he doesn't do that; Pierce and Rondo do that for your team.
[quote name='J7']So you think Gasol is as good as Russel and Chamberlain? Show me all the small players that defended these guys and their heights. Russel was only 6'9''. They both have had 50+ rebound games. Why don't you adjust that for today's standards... is 40 low enough for you? What is Gasol's best in a game for comparison? You think their stats are inflated but you have no way of proving that.[/QUOTE]
The game today is different than what it was back then. Thus you can't compare one for one. I think Pau Gasol is one of the best current Power Forwards in the league.
Like I mentioned before, Wilt and Russell played in an era where most players were small (6'5ish)... in other words, they didn't have to compete for boards since most people were too small to out jump them. For instance, Wilt's 1962 team... the next tallest guy on roster that played good minutes was 6'6 Tom Meschery... the majority of the team was 6'4. Pau, for instance, plays on a roster with a 7'0 Andrew Bynum, 6'10 Lamar Odom... the majority of the team is 6'7. Again, Russell and Chamberlain stats are inflated. It's why Howard can't outrebound/outblock them and it's why Jordan/Kobe couldn't outscore them. Different game than it once was.
[quote name='J7']They don't usually keep up with the smaller guys on switches. The best they usually do is use their big body to block them, but usually the small guy blows past them if he doesn't suck. Rondo doesn't have the jumper, but he does so much other than that to win games. Big deal they get some bruises. As if that means anything.
[/QUOTE]
Are you sure about that?
Exhibit A: Dwight Howard... you said Ray Allen doesn't suck, yet around the 1:15 mark he got past Howard only to be swatting to the fourth row.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cxCfBs0yZo&feature=related
I could add other players if you want.
As for Rondo, he was example of a small guy who couldn't make jumpers. I never said he wasn't a good driver and passer. I personally like Rondo because he plays with a lot of passion which lacks in the majority of NBA players.
And bruises do affect... ask some of your fellow Celtics i.e. Rasheed Wallace's back, Big Baby's concussion, etc.
[quote name='lordopus99']I never said he wasn't a great shooter. I said he couldn't create his own shot. If Ray is open, he will bang it in every time. To me, him and JJ Redick are practically the same. Give JJ some screens and well just ask any ACC team what he does (the magic don't run screens... i am awaiting the day that Van Gundy gains some more knowledge of how to play offensively).
As for Ray Allen, stop kidding yourself. The guy doesn't create his own jumper. I just watch a bunch of youtube clips just to make sure I mentioned it correctly; all proved my theory right. He either ran off screens or got a pass wide open from a driving player. I barely saw any clips where he actually drove on a player and created his own shot.[/QUOTE]
You couldn't be more wrong... As I said before, Ray Allen's bread and butter for many years was a fadeaway jumper off the dribble. He still does it but thats not what they run for him because they like to keep the ball in Rondo or Pierce's hands. And if Ray Allen never drives to the basket, how does he get to the line so often?
If you're looking for a catch and shoot guy that can't create his own shot, look at Eddie House.
As for Ray Allen, stop kidding yourself. The guy doesn't create his own jumper. I just watch a bunch of youtube clips just to make sure I mentioned it correctly; all proved my theory right. He either ran off screens or got a pass wide open from a driving player. I barely saw any clips where he actually drove on a player and created his own shot.[/QUOTE]
You couldn't be more wrong... As I said before, Ray Allen's bread and butter for many years was a fadeaway jumper off the dribble. He still does it but thats not what they run for him because they like to keep the ball in Rondo or Pierce's hands. And if Ray Allen never drives to the basket, how does he get to the line so often?
If you're looking for a catch and shoot guy that can't create his own shot, look at Eddie House.
Ray Allen actually surprised me about how much he drives I never noticed that until he was on my team kind of like I didn't know about how good of a passer KG was. Ray had no problem breaking down Sasha in 08
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i19lSd7pAiE&feature=fvst
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i19lSd7pAiE&feature=fvst
soulvengeance
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[quote name='dafoomie']You couldn't be more wrong... As I said before, Ray Allen's bread and butter for many years was a fadeaway jumper off the dribble. He still does it but thats not what they run for him because they like to keep the ball in Rondo or Pierce's hands. And if Ray Allen never drives to the basket, how does he get to the line so often?
If you're looking for a catch and shoot guy that can't create his own shot, look at Eddie House.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I'm with you on this, most people think he only shoots jumpers, but I've watched a couple of games where he has taken it to the rim. It may not be pretty, but he gets it done. Come on, JJ Redick? I've seen that dude miss a ton of wide open jumpers.
If you're looking for a catch and shoot guy that can't create his own shot, look at Eddie House.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I'm with you on this, most people think he only shoots jumpers, but I've watched a couple of games where he has taken it to the rim. It may not be pretty, but he gets it done. Come on, JJ Redick? I've seen that dude miss a ton of wide open jumpers.
- Status
bread's done