Halo 3 - General Discussion & Info

I think we fail to realize how large the single player maps are. From what I have seen while playing the GOW maps, they are not only small, but they are so linear and straight forward that it practically solves itself. Also, there are loading scenes in each Act, so I think when it comes to gow, only a small part of the entire map is loaded when playing co-op. Not a huge deal, since I was bound to play co-op with this one offline anyway.
 
[quote name='LinkinPrime']As far as I've heard, it was just speculation from a quote from Jeff Bell, MS Marketing VP:

"we're really looking forward to playing with my three sons, all together on Halo 3"

http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2007/07/14/halo-3-four-player-co-op-semi-confirmed/[/QUOTE]

Speculation indeed. I can't believe the amount of coverage that one little quote got. "Playing with my three sons" could mean just about fucking anything.
 
[quote name='help1']I think we fail to realize how large the single player maps are. From what I have seen while playing the GOW maps, they are not only small, but they are so linear and straight forward that it practically solves itself. Also, there are loading scenes in each Act, so I think when it comes to gow, only a small part of the entire map is loaded when playing co-op. Not a huge deal, since I was bound to play co-op with this one offline anyway.[/quote]


Crackdown. End of story.
 
The co-op news is the equivalent of full blown AIDS, but everyone seems to have skipped over the good news.

In happier news, EGM confirms several new weapons and vehicles. There is a dual-wieldable Brute shotgun called the Mauler and the gravity hammer we saw at E3 is confirmed as well. New equipment includes the Flare -- essentially a flashbang -- and the Regenerator, which refills shields (presumably for all those near the device). Three new vehicles, the Prowler, Hornet, and Elephant, which is described as a Jawa Sandcrawler. Halo fans will know that a Prowler is a recon ship with stealth abilities, though it is probably too large to be a playable vehicle. Finally, the article reveals that there will be a remake of the popular Halo 2 multiplayer map, Lockout, called Guardian.
 
[quote name='Kendal']Crackdown. End of story.[/quote]
crackdown u could do whatever u wanted to, regardless of what ur friend is. in halo u would need to be sorta following around ur friend as u try to advance through the campaign together. you cant really compare the 2.

with that said its still disappointing that they couldnt pull it off
 
[quote name='Trakan']The co-op news is the equivalent of full blown AIDS, but everyone seems to have skipped over the good news.[/QUOTE]

Lockout?!?!!? *drool*
 
It's really too bad about online co-op, I figured they would have it and I was planning on playing through the game with one of my friends over Live.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']Since that ran so well....?[/QUOTE]

Bad connection? I think Kendal and I have played a few times and it's ran perfectly.

In fact, every CAG who I've played Crackdown with, the game has run smooth.
 
[quote name='seanr1221']Bad connection? I think Kendal and I have played a few times and it's ran perfectly.

In fact, every CAG who I've played Crackdown with, the game has run smooth.[/QUOTE]

Well I played it in the first week of release, and tried playing it online with my friend, who only lived a few yards away, and no go. I think a patch was released though to fix the netcode?
 
[quote name='porieux']How exactly does implementing co-op in Halo3 differ so much from GoW or R6V?[/quote]
Game Development is more complicated than you think. They've already acknowledged that the fanbase wants it but there has to be a good reason development wise that makes it difficult to achieve. We as gamers and not developers cannot simplify things down to comparing the development of one game to another.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']Well I played it in the first week of release, and tried playing it online with my friend, who only lived a few yards away, and no go. I think a patch was released though to fix the netcode?[/QUOTE]

Not sure, I've been playing since the beginning and it's worked fine :whistle2:k

As for the Halo 3 issues...I dunno, it kind of screams *downloadable content*, which you know probably wont be free :whistle2:/

Could you imagine how much money MS would make off of that? Even at 400 points.
 
[quote name='seanr1221']Not sure, I've been playing since the beginning and it's worked fine :whistle2:k

As for the Halo 3 issues...I dunno, it kind of screams *downloadable content*, which you know probably wont be free :whistle2:/

Could you imagine how much money MS would make off of that? Even at 400 points.[/quote]
yea well...if ive already beaten the game by myself i have no reason to buy online co op.
 
If they do put online co-op out as paid DLC then thats total BS.

It will just go to prove MS are happy to ship out games that are missing major features and then have you pay for the rest :bs:
 
[quote name='benjamouth']If they do put online co-op out as paid DLC then thats total BS.

It will just go to prove MS are happy to ship out games that are missing major features and then have you pay for the rest :bs:[/QUOTE]
I like how people like you are getting mad about something they haven't mentioned or done.
 
[quote name='Trakan']The co-op news is the equivalent of full blown AIDS, but everyone seems to have skipped over the good news.[/quote]

This game is almost to perfection now with the remake of lockout...

And I'm sure Bungie will get the online co-op up as soon as they can. It does suck that it won't come with it though.
 
Damn, I just caught news of the no online co-op. It will be a major letdown if they can't have at least 2-player co-op because I had more fun with Gears co-op than I did with multiplayer.

"I think the biggest problem for us for online co-op is that we have a situation where you can be in a Warthog with five troops, almost a mile away from the other player. That's a significant challenge," says Frankie."
That makes sense but I wouldn't care if they had to butcher that level just for the online co-op mode. I could go back and play that level the way it was meant to be played in the single-player mode (or through split screen co-op).
 
Holllllllllllly shit.

Check out these pics located here:

http://www.gamespot.com/xbox360/action/halo3/show_msgs.php?topic_id=m-1-36888992&pid=926632

TONS of new crap. Guess the hackers were right, huh?

New stuff includes vehicles, weapons and power ups. Look at the pics, they are filled with info!

New brute shotgun, you can use the graivty hammer, new vehicle to combat the banshee (called the hornet), personal shield that doesnt cover 360 degrees, Prowler (some brute vehicle) and more!

Pretty much what Trakan has stated already.
 
halo3012.jpg


Here is oen of the several pics located at the link in my previous post.
 
You, know I'm wondering - from Bungie's quote about on-line co-op, it sounds like it's not so much a technical problem as a gameplay problem. If that's the case, what difference does is make when your friend is a mile away whether you are playing split screen or on-line??? Isn't the problem of dealing with cooperation the same either way?
 
I think it is a technical problem. If you guys are in a small corridor together like in Gears of War, the game only has to calculate your two guns shooting and the 2 or 3 enemies in front of you. In Halo 3, if you guys are a mile away with one guy driving a Warthog (which also produces taxing physics) with 5 soldiers around you (all with independent AI) and the other guy is fighting 5 enemies and all that crap going on between them for an entire mile, the 360 has to do crapload of work (not to mention the heavy lag from so many computations).

That is why I wouldn't mind if they cut that level out (just for online co-op) and kept it in single-player and split screen.
 
[quote name='Kendro']I think it is a technical problem. If you guys are in a small corridor together like in Gears of War, the game only has to calculate your two guns shooting and the 2 or 3 enemies in front of you. In Halo 3, if you guys are a mile away with one guy driving a Warthog (which also produces taxing physics) with 5 soldiers around you (all with independent AI) and the other guy is fighting 5 enemies and all that crap going on between them for an entire mile, the 360 has to do crapload of work (not to mention the heavy lag from so many computations).

That is why I wouldn't mind if they cut that level out (just for online co-op) and kept it in single-player and split screen.[/QUOTE]

Then that begs back to the Crackdown comparison, or games like GRAW with 16 player co-op where everyone could spread across a pretty big map and take out different groups at the same time. I just can't wrap my head around the fact that Bungie is so far ahead of every other developer in their multi-player stuff, and can't figure out co-op.

I'm still waiting for official/final confirm before I get too worked up. There's still a little time left.
 
[quote name='psychobrawler']Then that begs back to the Crackdown comparison, or games like GRAW with 16 player co-op where everyone could spread across a pretty big map and take out different groups at the same time. I just can't wrap my head around the fact that Bungie is so far ahead of every other developer in their multi-player stuff, and can't figure out co-op.

I'm still waiting for official/final confirm before I get too worked up. There's still a little time left.[/quote]

It might be something to jsut get us worked up about or a hype creating ploy, but your point with Crackdown is not a very good one in that the Co-Op in crackdown was a lagfest, where youwould be jumping and constantly have the game sort of 'freeze' for a couple seconds.
 
[quote name='help1']It might be something to jsut get us worked up about or a hype creating ploy, but your point with Crackdown is not a very good one in that the Co-Op in crackdown was a lagfest, where youwould be jumping and constantly have the game sort of 'freeze' for a couple seconds.[/QUOTE]

No no no. Once again, I have played crackdown with many people (personal friends, kendal, ryles, scorch) and I never got this "lag-fest" thing people keep saying.

I'm calling a big BS on there being no co-op in Halo 3...and no, having 5 soldiers in a warthog down the road isn't an excuse.
 
[quote name='seanr1221']No no no. Once again, I have played crackdown with many people (personal friends, kendal, ryles, scorch) and I never got this "lag-fest" thing people keep saying.

I'm calling a big BS on there being no co-op in Halo 3...and no, having 5 soldiers in a warthog down the road isn't an excuse.[/QUOTE]

I've put in quite a few hours on Crackdown now, and every single minute has been in co-op. I have only seen the slightest lag once or twice. I don't understand the bitching either. If Halo 3 ran as good as Crackdown does for me on-line, I'd have no problem with that.
 
[quote name='psychobrawler']I've put in quite a few hours on Crackdown now, and every single minute has been in co-op. I have only seen the slightest lag once or twice. I don't understand the bitching either. If Halo 3 ran as good as Crackdown does for me on-line, I'd have no problem with that.[/quote]

Also, I believe Crackdowns graphics weren't too hard to produce on the 360. Not to say they were bad, however, because I liked the graphical feel of the game. I disliked the lack of stuff to do in it.
 
[quote name='help1']Also, I believe Crackdowns graphics weren't too hard to produce on the 360. Not to say they were bad, however, because I liked the graphical feel of the game. I disliked the lack of stuff to do in it.[/quote]

They were cel-shaded which might have helped the computation of the co-op online, but I really couldn't say.
 
[quote name='thamaster24']They were cel-shaded which might have helped the computation of the co-op online, but I really couldn't say.[/quote]

You can say that they were cel-shaded, but if you talk to a Crackdown developer, they will go balistic on you for calling it cel-shaded.
 
[quote name='help1']You can say that they were cel-shaded, but if you talk to a Crackdown developer, they will go balistic on you for calling it cel-shaded.[/quote]

Ugh, I thought someone had confirmed it, anyway I'll just say that they weren't uhh "Great" Graphics.
 
The teleportation worked because despite the levels being large, they were still pretty linear. This makes me suspect that the levels for Halo 3 will be less linear, maybe have multiple paths and such, or will simply be a lot larger.

One thing to remember guys is that Crackdown is not Halo 3. Not only are the gameplay styles different, the fundamental AI, networking, etc... systems are different. I haven't played crackdown, but from what I get, the city was similar to GTA right? In GTA style cities, a lot of it is done procedurally, generated on the fly. Meaning the city is there as basic geometry, but otherwise the NPCs, enemies, are generated for the player as soon as he gets within a certain range of a target area. The AI should also show this on the fly nature by being less detailed.

Halo, on the other hand, has levels that are hand built with every entity pre-placed by level designers. Also the AI for the enemies is much more advanced. Usually the AI won't do anything while the player is out of range, thus saving on CPU and memory contraints, but what happens when there's two players that have both activated two seperate large AI groups at once and are fighting them at the same time?
 
More info from those EGM scans:

Single Player
Weapons and equipment - The rumors were true, the ‘Mauler a.k.a Excavator’ and ‘The Brute Hammer’ are very much present in the game in a playable form. The Mauler is the brute version of the Shotgun. You heard it right, the “Mauler” although is not as quite as powerful as the shotgun. But its feature of dual wielding will pump as much lead as a regular Shotgun. The Brute Hammer will be an extension of the energy sword. It can knock grenades back and flip vehicles and lunge/smash onto opponents like the energy sword.

The Regenerator - Works like the power drainer but opposite.

Personal Shield -A stationery version of the Jackals shield from Halo 2.

Flare - It’s a forerunner version of the Flashbang. This was probably the secret grenade that was being kept under wraps.

Radar Jammer - It screws up the radar once deployed, useless from the campaign’s point of view.

Invincibility - Can only be used by the Brute Chieftain for a specific amount of time.

Elephant
- Described as a Jawa Sandcrawler, it’s essentially a UNSC Spidey (Scarab…for the lame nerd). A dozen soldiers can ride it. It can house a Mongoose in its belly, is drivable, has a turret, can respawn troops, and holds both the flag and cap point. Only available on Sandtrap as of right now. Think Star wars in case you’re Imagination fails you.
Armor permutations - We all knew Master Chief was planning out a new look for himself, but according to the article the elites also look new and fresh.

Brutes - They stay towards rear, commanding others in encounters. Berserking is gone, but they will do a monkey charge if stripped of their technology. Chieftains come with Gravity Hammers and the same invincibility power Tartarus had. Oh and they can use jetpacks.

A.I. - The ogres can now climb, along with the rest of the Covenant.

The Arbiter - “No Raiden moment.” Campaign is Chief all the way, with Arbiter in tow for Co-op (offline), online Co-op yet to be confirmed This does not mean Arbiter won’t be selectable solo at all or rules out 4 player co-op, for further details are unknown.

Lighting, Sound, Music, Graphics – Godly! Around 40,000 voice clips too. Cursing used to indicate status, expanding on the graphic front here’s a quote right from the article, “There’s an encounter at the end of the second mission that you play that has more enemies allies than the entire first mission of Halo.”

The game is really looking good, far far better than the version that was shown at E3 2007. This game is shaping up to be one of the most exciting titles of the seasons.
http://www.gameguru.in/features/2007/20/halo-3-weapons-info-leaked/

Arbiter is available for offline Co-op....Shweet!
 
[quote name='slickkill77']Yep. Does anything think they may be adding to much stuff? In terms of weapons and what not?[/quote]

Even though they are adding a lot of new weapons, vehicles, etc. I think it might help balance out somewhat. People who generally aren't good with a BR might do much better than they did in Halo 2, with say a gun like the Spartan Laser.
 
[quote name='thamaster24']Even though they are adding a lot of new weapons, vehicles, etc. I think it might help balance out somewhat. People who generally aren't good with a BR might do much better than they did in Halo 2, with say a gun like the Spartan Laser.[/quote]

Also, some of these weapons and thigns might not be too powerful. Im thinking the mauler won't be too good and the personal shield is useless as you can throw grenades through the sides. Also, the equiptment seems to balance out some things from the beta, like the underused power drainer which I would use a lot as it was so easy to gang up on a group of 2 or more with it. Im thinking the personal shiled will only be useful if you are getting needled down and need something to save you ASAP, although as I said, tehy will jsut throw a grenade at you.
 
Guys check this out:

Forging new maps

Elephants aren't even the big new coming out of Bungie HQ during our visit. "We were looking for some ways to address some of the customizability gaps in previous Halo games," says Green. "And we were also really excited about giving the community something that they could sink their teeth into...to make things, collaborate on things, share things with each other." Enter: Forge. It's not a map editor in the traditional sense: You don't create any new stages from scratch, you don't alter any terrain or geometry, and you don't color everything bubblegum pink to match your new Volkswagen Beetle. What you do is run around a level and place objects.

Sounds incredibly boring and unambitious, doesn't it? We thought so, too, but what's on paper is very different from what's on the screen. When you boot up Forge, (à ) you assume the role of a monitor, those goofy floating-camera-ball AI who are always trying to start up trouble by getting someone to fire up a Halo - like 343 Guilty Spark. Your intentions are more innocuous, though - no all-life-ending notions here - just more for multiplayer. You fly around the map from within (like you're actually playing the game) and place objects, grab or move them around, or delete them. The items range from crates, barricades, and spawn/capture points to any weapon, equipment, or vehicle in the game (except, sadly, the Elephant) and can be modified as far as ammo count, respawn times, and other simple parameters. You only have a certain spending limit before you can't "buy" any more objects for the level, though.

At any time, you can push up on the D-pad and turn your Monitor into your normal multiplayer character model and start playing in the level you're modifying. This allows you to virtually test out your creations. And you can do all this simultaneously with your friends over Xbox Live, system link, or splitscreen. We tested this with seven players over system link, but the final headcount for Forge has yet to be made official.

Did you just yawn again? We admit it is difficult to describe why exactly Forge is fun. It's just something you have to try yourself to appreciate. But a lot of fun (and funny) things happen when you give people this playground to mess around in. It can be a simple, impromptu shootout: While your buddy's busy building that 50-foot tower of explosive fusion coils, why not transform into a Spartan, lob a grenade at the pile, and watch his work (and him) go boom? And when he respawns and comes after you for revenge, just become a Monitor again and zip away in the air to safety. Oh, did we mention Forge will keep score and keep track of the kills for you?

The Bungie developers found creative ways to play their own game within Forge. "One of the first things that happened on the first night that we had a playtest," says Bakken, "was theses two guys just started playing Jenga. They were making fusion coils, then they would stack a big crate on them, then they would stack more. If you screwed up and dropped it improperly, the entire thing blew up in your face." Other ad-libbed games at Bungie include Grab the Mongoose (one guy drives around the map; the other Monitors try to snag the ATV out from underneath him). Magic Carpet Ride (pick up a crate with a teammate on it and race him around the map without spilling him) and a real-time strategy way of playing Team Slayer (each team of normal players has one Monitor to create weapons and vehicles for them on the fly, reacting to what you see the other team equipping - or the Monitor can just fly over and delete the other team's gear!) You won't see any of these "modes" in the final game; you'll just have to recreate them if you want - or create your own. "It's more than a map editor," says Green. "It's also a place where you can play these honor-rules games."


Hmm, this forge thing sounds amazing for those nights where you don't want to play ranked and just play around with out aim with your friends.
 
"And you can do all this simultaneously with your friends over Xbox Live, system link, or splitscreen. We tested this with seven players over system link, but the final headcount for Forge has yet to be made official."

That's the most amazing part right there. All of that happening in real time? Wow.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']"And you can do all this simultaneously with your friends over Xbox Live, system link, or splitscreen. We tested this with seven players over system link, but the final headcount for Forge has yet to be made official."

That's the most amazing part right there. All of that happening in real time? Wow.[/quote]

Yea, that is going to be a real hardware burden with all the monitor switching and map editing.
 
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