LOST Season 5 Discussion - 5/13: The Incident -

The game aired during the same time Lost would have.

You could also have used TVGuide to find out this information
 
[quote name='kilm']The game aired during the same time Lost would have.

You could also have used TVGuide to find out this information[/quote]


...

Lost comes on Wednesday nights. The game was on Thursday.
 
[quote name='pitfallharry219']...

Lost comes on Wednesday nights. The game was on Thursday.[/quote]

And you can use several things to figure out the day. :lol:
 
[quote name='kilm']Oh yeah...[/quote]


major-payne.jpg




Who's the dummy now?
 
I'm leaning more & more to the "Daniel is Radzinski" theory. Here's why:
I believe the Swan station was built to house the Hydrogen Bomb. Daniel joins Dharma along with Sawyer, Jin & Miles. He is stationed there, where he gradually loses his mind (thinking about the death of Charlotte & such). He meets Kelvin, draws the Island Map on the blast door, & kills himself. That could explain why he started crying when he was watching the TV. Maybe he knows of his imending death.
 
I haven't abandoned that theory but I'm also fairly sure that (minor, somewhat speculative)
they cast someone for Radzinsky. I remember reading about it on IGN (I think) a couple months before the season started. Can't remember the actor's name. Regardless, that doesn't mean that Faraday doesn't become "Radzinsky" in the sense that something happens to him to make him think that's his name. I mean, we've already seen Widmore wearing the uniform of a U.S. military man named Jones (which didn't really fool me), so if Faraday somehow has to wear Rad's outfit, a memory loss could make him and everyone else believe that's his name. The other possibility is that the two of them start the Blast Door Map, and Faraday dies, leaving Radzinsky to finish it.

I also wonder if they'll go through the trouble of reconstructing the Swan Station's interior for what might be just a few scenes. Or maybe it plays a significant role again well into next season.
 
[quote name='Segasonic01']I'm leaning more & more to the "Daniel is Radzinski" theory. Here's why:
I believe the Swan station was built to house the Hydrogen Bomb. Daniel joins Dharma along with Sawyer, Jin & Miles. He is stationed there, where he gradually loses his mind (thinking about the death of Charlotte & such). He meets Kelvin, draws the Island Map on the blast door, & kills himself. That could explain why he started crying when he was watching the TV. Maybe he knows of his imending death.
[/QUOTE]

the only flaw with that theory,
is that the bomb was around 20 years before dharma. so it would have had to of been cased long before dharma shows up.
 
Decent episode. Not great, but decent. Some nice touches.

My apologies to those that correctly theorized about the identity of the baby.
But for someone roughly 27 in 2004, Ethan didn't age well.

Also,
The young Ben actor didn't age quite as quickly as Malcolm David Kelley did. I wonder how long the Linuses have been on the island, and if it's more than a week or so, why the time-skippers (apparently) didn't notice him.

I have no idea where this show is going now, but from the teaser for next week, it doesn't look like its "happy place."
 
I didn't think the episode was bad at all. It just wasn't amazing. Definitely had its interesting moments, though.

I'm with Jollydwarf on this on this. The actor playing Ethan looks at least 40 years old, so to guess that he was the mystery baby would have been a stretch.

I thought this was one of the more "human" Christian encounters we've seen, and by that I mean he didn't seem like a guiding spirit. He actually came across quite human, turning on lights, physically taking the photo off the wall, and actually not disappearing when we all probably expected him to.

Related to this encounter, it appears the barracks are still in shambles from the 2004 assault by Widmore's men. It was a pretty cool reality check, though, when Sun and Lupidis docked and saw that the area was in disarray. For a moment, I'd let myself believe they'd all landed at the same point in time.

Anyone have a theory as to why Sun wasn't pulled into 1977 with the rest of the Oceanic 6? Geez ... or Locke, for that matter, or even Ben or Lupidis? Are they meant to "go on a journey," as Christian implied?

I was kind of disappointed to see that Daniel did not turn out to be Radzinsky. Instead, Radzinsky kind of turned out to be a prick. That was a major letdown. I am interested to find out what Sawyer meant about Daniel when Jack asked about him.

There's was a little Easter egg in the epsiode, too, that I read. Sawyer asked Juliet where his big sweatshirt was, and it ended up being the one he gave to Hurley. It was a Georgia Bulldogs sweatshirt, and that's apparently where Josh Holloway went to college.

Oh, and the Lostpedia entry says that Jorge Garcia's girlfriend was one of the survivors from Ajira 316. The pretty one shown standing behind Sun on the beach.
 
[quote name='jollydwarf']Decent episode. Not great, but decent. Some nice touches.

My apologies to those that correctly theorized about the identity of the baby.
But for someone roughly 27 in 2004, Ethan didn't age well.

Also,
The young Ben actor didn't age quite as quickly as Malcolm David Kelley did. I wonder how long the Linuses have been on the island, and if it's more than a week or so, why the time-skippers (apparently) didn't notice him.

I have no idea where this show is going now, but from the teaser for next week, it doesn't look like its "happy place."[/QUOTE]

well they jack, hurley and kate were all introduced to dharma when a new sub came in. perhaps the linuses were on that boat, just getting on the island that day or so.


[quote name='jaso']I didn't think the episode was bad at all. It just wasn't amazing. Definitely had its interesting moments, though.

Anyone have a theory as to why Sun wasn't pulled into 1977 with the rest of the Oceanic 6? Geez ... or Locke, for that matter, or even Ben or Lupidis? Are they meant to "go on a journey," as Christian implied?

I was kind of disappointed to see that Daniel did not turn out to be Radzinsky. Instead, Radzinsky kind of turned out to be a prick. That was a major letdown. I am interested to find out what Sawyer meant about Daniel when Jack asked about him.
[/QUOTE]

my guess is sun, ben, frank and john werent supposed to go back. the island is a funny place, they must have a "purpose" for being in the 2007 timeline. im sure well learn that purpose over the rest of the season.

i think what sawyer meant about daniel being "gone" is mentally. charlotte said a crazy guy told her to not to come back. and we know that he was already taking her death very hard. my guess is the time travel is driving him mad because hes the one who best understands whats going on.
 
jaso, (concerning last night's episode)
I'm still not ready to totally rule out that somehow the real Radzinsky gets killed and Faraday gets isolated in the Swan, thinking that's his name (for whatever madness-related reason)...OR...they both start working on mapping the island together. We still haven't seen Dan exploring the subterranean caves as was very briefly shown in the initial Season Five teaser. Then again, it seems that in '77, the Swan is still some time away from it's grand opening (Dharmaburgers and punch for everyone!). Maybe we never see Radzinsky actually in the Swan (again, it would require them reconstructing that set, probably not a cheap endeavor).

And RAMSTORIA, while I think you've got a very plausible explanation, (also concerning last night's episode)
the only problem I have with that theory is that young Ben seems awfully familiar with the guy working in the station where Sayid is being held prisoner. His nonchalance seems to suggest that he's been there for more than a couple days. But I concede that he might have quickly latched on to the people there, what with his father not being his biggest supporter.

I also fully agree that Faraday is not physically dead or gone, but instead is just mentally 'somewhere else.' As in, fried circuits. It does make me wonder why the DI is still tolerating him if he's legitimately crazy. Maybe he's able to downplay it around people besides the time-skippers? And besides, we still haven't seen the payoff for the opening sequence of the season premiere, let alone
what we saw/heard in the Comic-Con 2008 video.

EDIT: For the record,
William Mapother (Ethan) was born on April 17th, 1965. That means that he was 39 when Season One was filming. I can get over it, but this is one instance where the show's production seems to be a little messy. The guy looked his age back then. Ethan would've won a lot of big stuffed polar bears from the 'Guess Your Age' guy at The Other's carnival, I'll just say that.
 
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So, how do you guys think Ethan went from Dharma to the others? My theory is that
he was kidnapped as a child, like Walt and the kids from the tail section.
 
Good question. Solid theory. However,
by 1992, he would be 15, the perfect age for pointless adolescent rebellion. I could very easily see him looking up to Ben and being one of the--how did Ben put it?--'smart ones' that survived The Purge. On a related note, boy, I hope that we see Tom again. He also seemed to have a very emotional loyalty to Ben. (Remember him almost crying when Jack was going to supposedly let Ben die on the table?) Feel free to crack jokes now.
 
Pretty weak episode last night...a total lead up to next weeks.

Anyone think that the dude that was building the model is the dude with the eye patch that was responsible for the death of Charlie?
 
[quote name='RAMSTORIA']
my guess is sun, ben, frank and john werent supposed to go back. the island is a funny place, they must have a "purpose" for being in the 2007 timeline. im sure well learn that purpose over the rest of the season.
[/quote]

I am pretty sure they are not in 2007 anymore,
Dharma logos were all over the compound.

Also
it seems that Locke is in the same situation as Christian is currently.
 
General question: is it me, or have they abandoned the "Holy shit!!" twist endings this season? If so, do you think that this is a conscious decision on the part of the creators and writers, or has the level of writing just slipped at least incrementally? No matter how great or disappointing a given episode has been this season, it really seems like they all end on a "..." as opposed to a "!!!"

For the record, I tend to think the writing hasn't been quite as sharp this year, with things being a little more telegraphed than they were in the past. True, after four seasons, many of us are keener about anticipating things, and we want more answers than questions, but I don't think that I can guess the show's next move when it's at the top of its game, no matter how much I've watched.

EDIT: Also, side topic: if the show isn't as sharp this year, do you think that maybe it's a concession they feel that they needed to make to keep it vaguely accessible for the 'watercooler crowd', while the chronology of the narrative is constantly jumping around? Sometimes I almost feel like the "Three Years Earlier"-type screens aren't really necessary, but instead hand-holding. Hey, ratings are everything. I get it. But what's the cost here?
 
[quote name='jollydwarf']General question: is it me, or have they abandoned the "Holy shit!!" twist endings this season? If so, do you think that this is a conscious decision on the part of the creators and writers, or has the level of writing just slipped at least incrementally? No matter how great or disappointing a given episode has been this season, it really seems like they all end on a "..." as opposed to a "!!!"

For the record, I tend to think the writing hasn't been quite as sharp this year, with things being a little more telegraphed than they were in the past. True, after four seasons, many of us are keener about anticipating things, and we want more answers than questions, but I don't think that I can guess the show's next move when it's at the top of its game, no matter how much I've watched.

EDIT: Also, side topic: if the show isn't as sharp this year, do you think that maybe it's a concession they feel that they needed to make to keep it vaguely accessible for the 'watercooler crowd', while the chronology of the narrative is constantly jumping around? Sometimes I almost feel like the "Three Years Earlier"-type screens aren't really necessary, but instead hand-holding. Hey, ratings are everything. I get it. But what's the cost here?[/QUOTE]

I think this year's season took a nose dive like you stated... but for your last edit, I thought that was what they were doing with the LOST FOR DUMMIES hour rerun that they were doing.....

I always joked about it... it's pathetic for someone that actively watches the show to miss something... and I could only see that as helping the ones that do need some hand-holding.

I think the Three years thing could have been played better and I agree aren't necessary.

I think I could have seen maybe one confussion transition.
 
These past two eps were the best of the season so far. Back to what the show did good, less pointless twists and action sequences.

lol at Radzinsky being Mikhail.

Yeah, they've tried for badass endings but they've pretty much failed.

Episode 1: Had this aired standalone, Des leaving had been in tons of promos and would have been an ass ending.
Episode 2: Cheesy "god help us all" from Hawking.
Episode 4: Yeah, we all knew it was Danielle the minute she showed up.
Episode 5: Another cheesy Hawking line.
Episode 6: This one wasn't that bad. Unfortunately I've known about Jin in a dharma suit for months. But still a good surprise ending.
 
I'm thinking Lapidus is a dead man walking - the first plane crash, one pilot killed on impact and the other eaten by the smoke monster shortly after. Second plane crash, one pilot killed on impact and the other arrives on the island to an "animal" knocking down trees in the jungle.
 
Unfortunately I've known about Jin in a dharma suit for months.

And that's why I stay away from big-time LOST message board discussions. Some users are malevolent, others just aren't thinking when typing. And yes, I agree that episode had the only ending that could arguably be consider a LOST-worthy twist. But not by much.

The so-called "dumbing down" apparently isn't helping, as last night's show had the lowest ratings in the history of the series.

No big surprise, what with the two-week break disrupting whatever momentum the show was building and the fact that I think the show has alienated most of the casual fans out there. It's all making the creators look more prescient by setting a distinct end date well in advance, but on the other hand, building towards a predetermined 'finish line' should make the show even more engrossing, right?

I'm pretty confident that about a year from now, the alienated and the disinterested will come flocking back, for the 'stretch run' payoff. I just wish that in the meantime, we'd get a better sense on what this season is building towards (besides "a war", which may not even begin in the next eight episodes).

Enjoy it while it lasts, kids. I seriously doubt we're going to see a network allow a show to take these kinds of risks and establish this convulted of a mythology again. And if they do, it's even less likely that the show will survive long enough to reach a satisfactory conclusion.
 
[quote name='StealthNinjaScyther']I'm thinking the reason that Sun didn't go back is because Locke never contacted her to try to bring her back like he did with everyone else.[/quote]

I think you're on to something there.

[quote name='JJSP']I'm thinking Lapidus is a dead man walking - the first plane crash, one pilot killed on impact and the other eaten by the smoke monster shortly after. Second plane crash, one pilot killed on impact and the other arrives on the island to an "animal" knocking down trees in the jungle.[/quote]

Yeah, I thought the same thing when I saw the rustling of the branches.
 
Thing about Lapidus is that he was the pilot that was supposed to be on 815. A lot of people have theorized that one of the Smoke Monster's purposes is to eliminate those that aren't supposed to be there, people who might alter the grand design or predetermined timeline.

Personally, I think it was
Christian following them. Yeah, uninteresting and the simplest explanation, but the sounds of the monster weren't heard, and it hasn't exactly been 'Twist City' this season. I think the writers wanted us to wonder what/who it was rustling the trees, so the revelation of Christian in the dilapidated barracks was probably the payoff to the mini-mystery.

Of course, that's just my theory...I could be wrong.*

EDIT: Obviously, I didn't catch that person or 'entity' in the background. I can say with confidence that it's not the Three Men and a Baby ghost kid. If it's "Claire", I doubt that they got Emilie de Ravin in for such an Easter Egg of a shot. But if it's supposed to be her character ('played' by an extra with a wig), it would make sense, considering that Locke didn't initially notice her in the cabin last season. She was lounging in the shadows.


*--I miss the ol' 'equal opportunity' Dennis Miller. But he's lost in Time, too, I suppose.
 
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[quote name='jollydwarf']
EDIT: Obviously, I didn't catch that person or 'entity' in the background. I can say with confidence that it's not the Three Men and a Baby ghost kid. If it's "Claire", I doubt that they got Emilie de Ravin in for such an Easter Egg of a shot. But if it's supposed to be her character ('played' by an extra with a wig), it would make sense, considering that Locke didn't initially notice her in the cabin last season. She was lounging in the shadows.


[/QUOTE]

I thought the same thing. If Claire isn't supposed to have a major role anytime soon or something, they could just throw in a look-a-like to pass as her for now.
 
[quote name='willardhaven']I am pretty sure they are not in 2007 anymore,
Dharma logos were all over the compound.

[/QUOTE]

I thought the same thing
The main island (For Sun and Frank) must be on a whole 3rd timeline now. Since there were Dharma photos on the wall, signs for the Dharma buildings, etc. That wasn't there when the Others lived there.
 
hey ken, can you put that picture in spoilers, not because of spoiling, but because its so big.
*edit, nevermind looks smaller now... did you change it?

i hope they dont kill off frank. i like him, even though scruffy frank was better.

phil (the dharma guy that checked in kate) looks like hes going to be trouble. he gave jack a really suspicious look when he asked to see james and seemed skeptical of kate even after juliet brought the updated manifest.
 
[quote name='KongaKing']I thought the same thing
The main island (For Sun and Frank) must be on a whole 3rd timeline now. Since there were Dharma photos on the wall, signs for the Dharma buildings, etc. That wasn't there when the Others lived there.
[/quote]
So sometime between the Purge and the 815 crash - but if Ben and his people eradicated the Dharma Initiative with the Purge, one would think that the odds of Ben running into himself are pretty high. He happened to know exactly where the outriggers were, which means he would have had a pretty good idea of "when" they were.
 
[quote name='JJSP']So sometime between the Purge and the 815 crash - but if Ben and his people eradicated the Dharma Initiative with the Purge, one would think that the odds of Ben running into himself are pretty high. He happened to know exactly where the outriggers were, which means he would have had a pretty good idea of "when" they were.[/QUOTE]

i think what he meant was an alternate future. meaning the losties in 1977 change the future from what it was when everyone was off the island. on the show they said in black and white (literally) that the two groups were 30 years apart (1977 and 2007). i know the producers like to mind fuck us, but i dont think theyd be that blatent.
 
No, There won't be any alternate futures. My only guess is that this current timeline could be after the purge, yeah. Not sure yet though but why else are there Dharma logos and stuff all over?

Edit: Ben knew where the boats were because, it was the present on the Hydra station island. But going from Island 1 to Island 2, the timeline seems to not match up.
 
[quote name='JJSP']He happened to know exactly where the outriggers were, which means he would have had a pretty good idea of "when" they were.[/quote]

I think that outrigger stuff was just a teaser. To explain how the boats wound up on the crash beach, eventually the "new survivors" probably take them there...maybe when Ben wakes up and tells them where the pilot and the Korean lady ran off to. I think the Middle Eastern dude was probably who was shooting at Sawyer, Juliet, etc. His first order of business the first night seemed to be collecting arms (like the shotgun he found and hid from everyone else).

Anyways, I think the boats were just another hidden transportation method for the Others, common knowledge among them all. Not to say Ben doesn't know exactly what's going on, he probably does.

The one island is probably post-Purge but pre-Others moving in and taking over. Maybe literally the night after it happened, while the Others are at the other stations gassing Dharma employees. Looks clearly like some commotion went on there, and old relics of Dharma are all over but the Others didn't move in. The dock is still intact, so it has to be while the submarine is out, not after John sabotaged it years later.
 
the middle eastern dude is named ceasr, pretty sure hes hispanic ;)

but it doesnt seem likely that he was the one shooting at them since, at the time, they only seemed to be jumping around the past and not the present/future. but it could be.
 
- As the plane's co-pilot issues a Mayday call, he picks up a transmission of a voice reading the numbers. The origin of this transmission is a mystery, as DHARMA's original radio message was replaced by Rousseau's distress in 1988, and that broadcast was subsequently terminated in 2004 during the events of "Through The Looking Glass".

That was posted on Lostpedia, but I didn't catch it during the episode. There shouldn't have been any broadcasts going out from the island, and certainly wouldn't be any playing "the numbers" in 2008/2009.
 
But did Rousseau even place the distress call? Jin never showed her where the radio tower was. She's resourceful enough to find it on her own, so I don't think it's a Back To The Future kind of thing.
 
2 questions


So jack is the dead person they found in the back of the Van who had the WORKMAN outfit on


and the Time rip hasnt happen yet since its been 3 years on the island and off

If ben meet all of these people when he was younger why wouldnt he know them when he first saw them when they crashed
 
I'm super-confused now. The landing strip (no, uninitiated lurkers, not that kind of landing strip) was being developed in Season Three, i.e., 2004. The time-skippers, when they find one of the outriggers, also find a run-down, long-abandoned version of the 815ers camp. Is it safe to guess that the Ajira flight was never temporally displaced? That they're in 2007? After all, the show last night transitioned with "30 years Earlier".

Or am I missing the crux of the recent conversation here?
 
[quote name='JJSP']- As the plane's co-pilot issues a Mayday call, he picks up a transmission of a voice reading the numbers. The origin of this transmission is a mystery, as DHARMA's original radio message was replaced by Rousseau's distress in 1988, and that broadcast was subsequently terminated in 2004 during the events of "Through The Looking Glass".

That was posted on Lostpedia, but I didn't catch it during the episode. There shouldn't have been any broadcasts going out from the island, and certainly wouldn't be any playing "the numbers" in 2008/2009.[/QUOTE]

3 years have passed since "through the looking glass", someone could have returned on broadcast and the numbers could be playing again.

[quote name='jollydwarf']I'm super-confused now. The landing strip (no, uninitiated lurkers, not that kind of landing strip) was being developed in Season Three, i.e., 2004. The time-skippers, when they find one of the outriggers, also find a run-down, long-abandoned version of the 815ers camp. Is it safe to guess that the Ajira flight was never temporally displaced? That they're in 2007? After all, the show last night transitioned with "30 years Earlier".

Or am I missing the crux of the recent conversation here?[/QUOTE]

that sounds right. like i said, the ajira people are in 2007. the show very distinctly said "30 years earlier" which implies they are in 2007.

we would also assume that the landing strip is what sawyer and kate were working on when they were held captive in season 3. that raises the question of if ben or jacob (or both) knew that the ajira plane would be arriving 3 years from now.
 
Rousseau placed her own distress call back in 1988 - that's the one they picked up in French on the beach during the earlier seasons. The radio tower was turned off in 2004, so when they flew back to the island in present-day, there shouldn't have been any transmissions coming off of the island.
 
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