MMA (Mixed Martial Arts) Thread: UFC/Strikeforce

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[quote name='Thekrakrabbit']There is this idea that Lesnar struck with Velasquez and got knocked out, he didn't. He ran across the cage and shot for a takedown but Velasquez got back up and battered him with striking. I think Brock is aware of his inability to react to getting hit and his poor striking skills and I'm sure he will try to wrestlehump Overeem, I just have a feeling that this is a fight Overeem will win easily and possibly quickly in devastating fashion.[/QUOTE]


I actually think Brock will have an easy go with the wrestlehumping, but if can't it will be a short night. I am happy to finally see Overeem fight top talent though, it will sort of be his coming out party if he wins, I just don't know if he can stay on his feet.
 
Good for Carlos Condit and good for Dana White. I'm really getting tired of the Diaz brothers white trash routine. First the shit with Mayhem and now this. It's like they go out of their way to disrespect the sport. Freaking losers. I'd rather see Jon Fitch get another title shot before Diaz gets a crack at it again.
 
[quote name='paz9x']http://bjpenn.com/news/2011/09/07/cesar-gracie-goes-in-depth-on-nick-diaz-absence-4285.html
not what I expected him to say about it.
Condit is a better guy and im glad hes getting the shot.[/QUOTE]

Haha, I love how people are speculating that Nick is just MIA and are concerned for his well being. Cesar wouldn't say something like that if he hadn't heard from him at all. My guess is Nick gave some sort of "I don't feel like it" excuse or he's strung out on drugs or something crazy that we just don't know about. Either way, I'm sure it's some byproduct of just being a douchebag.
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']Haha, I love how people are speculating that Nick is just MIA and are concerned for his well being. Cesar wouldn't say something like that if he hadn't heard from him at all. My guess is Nick gave some sort of "I don't feel like it" excuse or he's strung out on drugs or something crazy that we just don't know about. Either way, I'm sure it's some byproduct of just being a douchebag.[/QUOTE]

exactly, the guy is a fuckup. im just surprisd to hear it as plainly from cesar, i expected some lame bullshit.
 
Diaz burning bridges left and right. Cesar would've damage controlled better if he had thought Nick hadn't fucked up as bad as he did.
 
4 Events. 4 Saturdays. I haven't really been keeping up with UFC like I used to, just big cards really. But damn, I can say there are some interesting match ups this month. Especially excited for Edgar v Maynard III and Aldo vs Florian.
 
Condit is a good match up for GSP and deserves a title shot IMO as well. He was going to smack Penn around so we'll see how he will do against the best welterweight in the world.

Condit fights wicked good off his back and has good wrestling and outstanding top control, not to mention better striking then GSP and huge power. There is a chance Condit gets humped for five rounds like MacDonald almost did for their whole fight, but Condit will only need ONE chance and he's the new champion.
 
Diaz vs Penn would be a very interesting match-up in my eyes. They both have excellent jj and very good stand-up, I would love to see this fight more than GSP/Diaz or Condit/Penn even though I did like the Condit/Penn matchup. I'm not sure Dana would do this though, he can be pretty spiteful when people cross him but if it makes dollars it makes sense in a business world so I can cross my fingers and hope.
 
Diaz/Penn is set for the same card as Condit/GSP. Diaz is in tough and I think Dana might be trying to feed Diaz a loss for screwing up the title fight. Diaz can't submit Penn off his back, has no takedown defense and Penn is too durable to just knock out within three rounds.
 
[quote name='Maklershed']Strikeforce GP continues tomorrow. :whee:

(prelims on HDNET)[/QUOTE]

This card is pretty stacked! I can't wait for the fights to start, I think Barnett and Cormier will win but would not be surprised if Bigfoot wins. I looked up Cormier's background since I haven't watched him before and his wrestling sounds legit and it seems that dominant wrestling is the best skillset to have right now in mma. Also excited for the Gracie/Lawal fight.
 
Interesting SF card. IMO Jacare won the fight and was robbed, and Cormier was surprising knocking out Silva so easily. Barnett has all the tools to beat him though, better wrestling and can/will submit him if he gets on top.
 
[quote name='Thekrakrabbit']Interesting SF card. IMO Jacare won the fight and was robbed, and Cormier was surprising knocking out Silva so easily. Barnett has all the tools to beat him though, better wrestling and can/will submit him if he gets on top.[/QUOTE]
Cormier win was a surprise especially how it was done so easy. Barnett does not have better wrestling skills than Cormier. Cormier is the captain of the US Olympic wrestling team. I think the final goes to a decision or Cormier knocks out Barnett.
 
Cormier/Barnett fight should be good, idk who will win. I will be rooting for Barnett because I always have liked him as a fighter, pretty good skillset and I would like to see him in the UFC eventually to see how he does. I don't think he will be champ or anything but he could be a pretty good HW.
 
[quote name='silentevil']Cormier win was a surprise especially how it was done so easy. Barnett does not have better wrestling skills than Cormier. Cormier is the captain of the US Olympic wrestling team. I think the final goes to a decision or Cormier knocks out Barnett.[/QUOTE]

He should have said barnett has better grappling, hes a very very good grappler. I think cormier keeps it on the feet if he has his choice.
 
Barnett does undoubtedly have better grappling skills, but the fact that Cormier was this and that on the Olympic team doesn't mean that Barnett isn't much bigger, stronger and a deadly catch wrestler. It doesn't matter to me how good everyone thinks Cormier is with his wrestling, he cannot just throw Barnett around and can't hold a candle to him in the clinch. If they were in a wrestling match, Barnett would win so that means he is the better all around wrestler, yes?
 
[quote name='blueweltall']UFC 139 Nov. 19th

Vitor Belfort vs. Cung Le![/QUOTE]

I wouldn't sleep on Cung Le, but if Belfort doesn't get a stoppage, I'll be a bit surprised.
 
[quote name='Thekrakrabbit']Barnett does undoubtedly have better grappling skills, but the fact that Cormier was this and that on the Olympic team doesn't mean that Barnett isn't much bigger, stronger and a deadly catch wrestler. It doesn't matter to me how good everyone thinks Cormier is with his wrestling, he cannot just throw Barnett around and can't hold a candle to him in the clinch. If they were in a wrestling match, Barnett would win so that means he is the better all around wrestler, yes?[/QUOTE]

I would put my money on cormier in a wrestling match. He is a international level wrestler, there is a difference. Barnett is a big mofo though and that is significant. I think barnett's grappling is fantastic, arguably the best current heavyweight grappler. Like I said in a previous post, I think cormier keeps this on the feet if he has a choice. Barnett is a BEAST on the mat.
 
i like barnett and hope he can win but cormier doesn't appear to be a chump. barnett has never looked better on his feet than he did vs. crocop in the GP years ago but it proved to me he does have standup skills he just doesn't bother using.

there are some seriously awesome fights coming and i hope they can live up to my expectations.
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']Glad to see Jake Shields get exposed. Amazing what can happen when you don't let him dry hump you for 15 minutes. Rough week for the "Diaz Gang". :)[/QUOTE]

I agree Jake Shields isn't the most exciting fighter out there, but I do give him credit for going out there against a super tough opponent when his dad/manager died about 2 or 3 weeks ago.

There is no way Shields was mentally prepared for this fight. I'm sure the weeks up to this fight have been hell for him, and even if his camp was fantastic before his dad's death I'm sure fighting was the farthest thing from his mind.
 
Much respect to Shields for not pulling out of the fight when his Dad died, but it seemed like he was going in there knowing he was going to lose. There's no way you recover from that kind of thing that quick and have your mind on the match. Especially a technical fighter like Shields.

Belcher looked pretty good in his return fight. Court Mc Gee won his fight but he needs alot of work. He got tagged with Yangs jab quite a bit and looked kinda sluggish. Lucky for him Yang gassed out.
 
Ellenberger ran through him like he does most people, quite nice. I would certainly disagree with Shields being "exposed" though, his resume speaks for itself and if he were at middleweight (like he should be), Shields would be doing much better. He looks horrible at WW because he is just too weak.
 
[quote name='Dokstarr']I agree Jake Shields isn't the most exciting fighter out there, but I do give him credit for going out there against a super tough opponent when his dad/manager died about 2 or 3 weeks ago.

There is no way Shields was mentally prepared for this fight. I'm sure the weeks up to this fight have been hell for him, and even if his camp was fantastic before his dad's death I'm sure fighting was the farthest thing from his mind.[/QUOTE]

I can agree completely with that, and honestly would have respected him more if he had just pulled out of the fight. I don't think anybody (including Dana White) would have blamed him. If you're not going into the cage with your mind right, you might as well not bother. He did himself a disservice by fighting under those conditions, but I hate that it's going to be used as an excuse.

Ellenberger is a legit opponent, and I think he would have beaten even a "focused" Shields. My point was that Shields skill set has never been terribly impressive to me. He's looked like crap in his last three fights and was lucky to get a win over Kampmann. I don't like him, and I don't like the crowd he hangs out with. Just my opinion.

Also, yeah, I'd love to see Shields at MW fighting guys like Silva, Belfort, and Sonnen. Yeah, he'd be doing MUCH better. The reason he's fighting at WW is so nobody notices how overrated he is. Hell, I don't even think he could handle Carlos Condit right now.
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']I can agree completely with that, and honestly would have respected him more if he had just pulled out of the fight. I don't think anybody (including Dana White) would have blamed him. If you're not going into the cage with your mind right, you might as well not bother. He did himself a disservice by fighting under those conditions, but I hate that it's going to be used as an excuse.

Ellenberger is a legit opponent, and I think he would have beaten even a "focused" Shields. My point was that Shields skill set has never been terribly impressive to me. He's looked like crap in his last three fights and was lucky to get a win over Kampmann. I don't like him, and I don't like the crowd he hangs out with. Just my opinion.

Also, yeah, I'd love to see Shields at MW fighting guys like Silva, Belfort, and Sonnen. Yeah, he'd be doing MUCH better. The reason he's fighting at WW is so nobody notices how overrated he is. Hell, I don't even think he could handle Carlos Condit right now.[/QUOTE]

Carlos Condit is a WW! Of course Shields would have trouble with him, because the guy is too drained at MW. He looked worse then ever against Kampmann and just weak against GSP. He just got KTFO'd against Ellenberger quickly, but nonetheless he did still get his first takedown stuffed.

If Jake was at MW like he should be, he would be looking much, much better for sure. As for the other notes, his team is great (I don't like the Cesar Gracie team for the most part but they have skills) and I don't think his Dad dying effected his performance in this fight. He would have still shot early in the fight and eventually got hit with something big whether or not his Dad died.
 
Only reason I brought up Condit is because they've fought before and Shields won. I just don't think he could do it again. They're both different fighters now.
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']Only reason I brought up Condit is because they've fought before and Shields won. I just don't think he could do it again. They're both different fighters now.[/QUOTE]

I know, but back then Shields was more comfortable making that weight. At this point of being 32, he can barely make WW without dying and in his last three fights at the weight he has been seriously stunned or knocked out.
 
Watching Titan FC on HDNet...Brett Rogers just dropped a decision to Eddie Sanchez. Horrible, inactive fight. Neither of these guys should ever see the light of day in a big promotion again. Jamie Varner's up now.
 
[quote name='JoshTX']Watching Titan FC on HDNet...Brett Rogers just dropped a decision to Eddie Sanchez. Horrible, inactive fight. Neither of these guys should ever see the light of day in a big promotion again. Jamie Varner's up now.[/QUOTE]

Eddie Sanchez is pretty poor and I think Rogers not being able to knock him out shows that he is past his "prime" point of his career. Not saying he's "shot" or anything...yet...but if he can't beat a guy like Sanchez we will never see him in another SF/UFC/anywhere decent again.

BTW, UFC 135 going now. Jones stoppage, Diaz submission (I would guess), Browne quick stoppage, Koscheck KO. Hunt is also a live underdog against Rothwell but could end up getting humped to death.

P.S. Ring will lose tonight as well I believe, Boetsch is in another class.
 
Boetsch at 185 is a whole different animal than Boetsch at 205. And that hip toss of his was amazing.

Ferguson is legit. Reminds me of Prince Naseem.
 
Ya know, I'm really over seeing these big heavyweights fight. Aside from a very short list, most of them are just fat, out of shape, and have a two minute gas tank. You're not going to convince me you're some bad ass tough guy if the secret to beating you is to make you chase me for 2 minutes and then I can push you around and hit you whenever I please.

Don't take this the wrong way...this DOES NOT apply to Cain Velasquez who is just a monster who won't stop coming. But a lot of these "top heavyweights" are a joke. Even a talented guy like Shane Carwin just can't support his own muscle mass long enough to be taken seriously.

Meanwhile, Nate Diaz (who I'm not a fan of) looked amazing tonight and showed ridiculous skill. I started feeling bad for Gomi as the fight seemed to take on this weird appearance of a high school bully picking on the nerdy Asian mathlete, lol. He was picking Gomi apart, and Gomi was just trying to not get hit in the head.

EDIT - Damn, are we ready to annoint Jon Jones the "Michael Jordan" of MMA yet? I can't help but feel like he represents everything the sport has been working toward for twenty years now. An extremely well-rounded fighter who is highly skilled at EVERYTHING, who also possesses unmatched physical attributes. At 205, he's simply going to be bigger, faster, and stronger than everybody he faces, and on top of that, he shows incredible intelligence and creativity to keep his opponents off balance the entire fight. Not to mention, he's a humble guy who seems to truly appreciate the position he's in. As happy as I am that the Cain vs. Junior fight is going to be the one to usher in the UFC on network programming, I feel like Jon Jones will be the face of the sport in a year or two. Jon Jones is MMA.
 
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To Rampage's credit, he did look a little better than his usual unmotivated, plodding forward self. He was owned every round though. The reach disadvantage made all the difference in the world. Jones knew how to stand right outside the pocket and use his long legs to his advantage. Quentin was reduced to trying to throw wild haymakers at Jones while jumping towards him to try to close off the gap.
 
[quote name='Maklershed']Boetsch at 185 is a whole different animal than Boetsch at 205. And that hip toss of his was amazing.

Ferguson is legit. Reminds me of Prince Naseem.[/QUOTE]

Hamed? OH NO YOU DIDN'T! :rofl: Comparing the two is like saying a Volvo is as great to drive as a Porsche...seriously...
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']Ya know, I'm really over seeing these big heavyweights fight. Aside from a very short list, most of them are just fat, out of shape, and have a two minute gas tank. You're not going to convince me you're some bad ass tough guy if the secret to beating you is to make you chase me for 2 minutes and then I can push you around and hit you whenever I please.

Don't take this the wrong way...this DOES NOT apply to Cain Velasquez who is just a monster who won't stop coming. But a lot of these "top heavyweights" are a joke. Even a talented guy like Shane Carwin just can't support his own muscle mass long enough to be taken seriously.

Meanwhile, Nate Diaz (who I'm not a fan of) looked amazing tonight and showed ridiculous skill. I started feeling bad for Gomi as the fight seemed to take on this weird appearance of a high school bully picking on the nerdy Asian mathlete, lol. He was picking Gomi apart, and Gomi was just trying to not get hit in the head.

EDIT - Damn, are we ready to annoint Jon Jones the "Michael Jordan" of MMA yet? I can't help but feel like he represents everything the sport has been working toward for twenty years now. An extremely well-rounded fighter who is highly skilled at EVERYTHING, who also possesses unmatched physical attributes. At 205, he's simply going to be bigger, faster, and stronger than everybody he faces, and on top of that, he shows incredible intelligence and creativity to keep his opponents off balance the entire fight. Not to mention, he's a humble guy who seems to truly appreciate the position he's in. As happy as I am that the Cain vs. Junior fight is going to be the one to usher in the UFC on network programming, I feel like Jon Jones will be the face of the sport in a year or two. Jon Jones is MMA.[/QUOTE]

Browne's cardio issues cost him an easy stoppage IMO, because he did nothing after the first round except for tag him and move/take him down and waste time. He soundly beat up Broughton like it was obvious he was going to, but man did he look poor tonight.

Diaz did look better as well but he is not a top guy. Has zero strength and people like Dong Hyun Kim who can take him down constantly or Maynard who can outstrike him will always be beating him.

Jones is just a beast and he continues to impress everytime he fights. He will kill Shogun and Evans, Henderson has the best shot to beat him (although I think even the H-bomb will be defeated as well).
 
In my opinion, the best shot anybody has of beating Jones is by outwrestling him. The problem is, most of the better wrestlers at 205 are undersized and could easily fight at 185 (Evans, Henderson). He's just too big and strong to let himself be controlled by those guys. Even Bader couldn't handle him. Other than just landing a lucky wild punch, I feel like getting him on the ground is the only chance anybody has of dictating where the fight goes. Easier said than done though, lol.
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']In my opinion, the best shot anybody has of beating Jones is by outwrestling him. The problem is, most of the better wrestlers at 205 are undersized and could easily fight at 185 (Evans, Henderson). He's just too big and strong to let himself be controlled by those guys. Even Bader couldn't handle him. Other than just landing a lucky wild punch, I feel like getting him on the ground is the only chance anybody has of dictating where the fight goes. Easier said than done though, lol.[/QUOTE]

Henderson isn't really an undersized LHW, he cannot make 185 anymore without guaranteeing himself another loss. Also, Bader isn't THAT great of a wrestler so I don't think saying "he couldn't handle him" is really that big of a statement.

I do agree though that the best shot of beating him is probably to wrestle him. If/when Jones moves up to HW that is probably when we see him start to lose, because I think he beats most everyone at LHW and even Anderson (due to wrestling).
 
I have no clue who will be Jones, I was sad to see Rampage lose but I expected it. He is def. a freak of nature, a couple of weeks ago I was telling my friend he reminded me of when Mike Vick came into the NFL, he just seems like he is on a different level than everybody else. Also, do you guys think that with his pretty large frame that he will be able to cut to 205 his whole career? It just seems that with a little age that he will fill out a little more and the 205 cut might be very difficult.
 
[quote name='icp_00_111']I have no clue who will be Jones, I was sad to see Rampage lose but I expected it. He is def. a freak of nature, a couple of weeks ago I was telling my friend he reminded me of when Mike Vick came into the NFL, he just seems like he is on a different level than everybody else. Also, do you guys think that with his pretty large frame that he will be able to cut to 205 his whole career? It just seems that with a little age that he will fill out a little more and the 205 cut might be very difficult.[/QUOTE]

I think he's cutting to 205 just fine right now, but by the time he's 28 or so maybe he will be ready to move up and be a Velasquez-sized HW.
 
[quote name='Thekrakrabbit']Barnett does undoubtedly have better grappling skills, but the fact that Cormier was this and that on the Olympic team doesn't mean that Barnett isn't much bigger, stronger and a deadly catch wrestler. It doesn't matter to me how good everyone thinks Cormier is with his wrestling, he cannot just throw Barnett around and can't hold a candle to him in the clinch. If they were in a wrestling match, Barnett would win so that means he is the better all around wrestler, yes?[/QUOTE]
I dunno about that.Cormier is a GREAT wrestler, like one of the very best going in mma.Barnnet while a good wrestler himself isn't really that close to him on just a wrestling level.Personally I see the fight going to a situation where using his background to keep it standing and ends up tearing Josh up with shots and possibly finishing him.If Cormier doesn't wanna go to the mat, hes not going to that mat but sadly for Barnnet I think Cormier edges him out in striking too.Cormier skill wise I think is top ten at this point.Its mma though, anything could happen :lol:.
 
[quote name='Magiblaze']I dunno about that.Cormier is a GREAT wrestler, like one of the very best going in mma.Barnnet while a good wrestler himself isn't really that close to him on just a wrestling level.Personally I see the fight going to a situation where using his background to keep it standing and ends up tearing Josh up with shots and possibly finishing him.If Cormier doesn't wanna go to the mat, hes not going to that mat but sadly for Barnnet I think Cormier edges him out in striking too.Cormier skill wise I think is top ten at this point.Its mma though, anything could happen :lol:.[/QUOTE]

Barnett can take down anyone in MMA's HW division right now, if he gets ahold of Cormier in the clinch that little HW is going down.
 
Cormier aint going down if he doesn't want to by Barnnet even in the clinch.Their wrestling skill is pretty far apart to determine that.I don't think Cormier will even go to the clinch, he'll just move around and pop him some good ones.
 
[quote name='Magiblaze']Cormier aint going down if he doesn't want to by Barnnet even in the clinch.Their wrestling skill is pretty far apart to determine that.I don't think Cormier will even go to the clinch, he'll just move around and pop him some good ones.[/QUOTE]

If Josh manages to absorb a punch or two and shoots in he should be able to hold Cormier down for the majority of the round. Personally, I haven't seen Cormier have to work off his back yet, so I don't know how comfortable he is, but he better be good if he's going to avoid submission.
 
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