Wii U - General Discussion Thread

Deader2818 said:
Even if Nintendo ever does get out of the console market, they will still make a shit ton in handhelds
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I mean, when I read that quote I think he's talking about the Wii U. I'm not sure that he's talking about home consoles in general. Hell, maybe they could make a 3DS TV. I'd buy it.

The Wii U really is a mistake because of the unusual (for Nintendo) hardware losses it generates. In order to recoup those a losses they need to sell 3rd party games and get licensing fees. Prior to launch they were saying that they finally have a console that can play the games that the others can run and most people were scratching their heads because of the upcoming launches of more powerful hardware a year away.
 
To be fair, I think that was meant more as "here's an HD console, finally". Not that it would match the next ones on pure specs, but at least it is in the same game, so to speak.

And why do they have to sell 3rd party games/licenses? All they have to do is sell a couple of first-party games and each console is profitable, right? (I think it was just 1 before the price cut - so maybe it is 2 now or maybe not if their costs have come down)
 
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io said:
To be fair, I think that was meant more as "here's an HD console, finally". Not that it would match the next ones on pure specs, but at least it is in the same game, so to speak.And why do they have to sell 3rd party games/licenses? All they have to do is sell a couple of first-party games and each console is profitable, right? (I think it was just 1 before the price cut - so maybe it is 2 now or maybe not if their costs have come down)
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Well, they could cover losses with first party sales - that's true but that would be fairly difficult because they would have to sell even more to cover the development costs of the game itself. So they'd need to have some massive blockbuster hits.
 
Blaster man said:
I read that as, if the current holiday doesn't bring success, they may abandon the Wii U.
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There is no way they sell to Apple and there is no way they just abandon the WiiU after 1 year. Every single time Nintendo doesn't knock it out of the park with something people are predicting doom and gloom for the company - this has been going on for 20+ years. They have a TON of money and the best IP in the business - and they are stubborn. It's just not going to happen. If the WiiU isn't a huge success I don't think they care as long as they are making a profit (which they will eventually). Plus, the 3DS is killing it.

We may get the next system in 2017 instead of 2018 but that's as far as they will go given their history.

NES 1983, (huge success; 7 years)

SNES 1990 (huge success; 6 years)

N64 1996 (meh; 5 years)

Gamecube 2001 (meh; 5 years)

Wii 2006 (huge success; 6 years)

WiiU 2012 (???)

I honestly believe it is the stupid name that is killing them this time. Maybe they should just rebrand it?

 
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Javery said:
There is no way they sell to Apple and there is no way they just abandon the WiiU after 1 year. Every single time Nintendo doesn't knock it out of the park with something people are predicting doom and gloom for the company - this has been going on for 20+ years. They have a TON of money and the best IP in the business - and they are stubborn. It's just not going to happen. If the WiiU isn't a huge success I don't think they care as long as they are making a profit (which they will eventually). Plus, the 3DS is killing it.

We may get the next system in 2017 instead of 2018 but that's as far as they will go given their history.

NES 1983, (huge success; 7 years)

SNES 1990 (huge success; 6 years)

N64 1996 (meh; 5 years)

Gamecube 2001 (meh; 5 years)

Wii 2006 (huge success; 6 years)

WiiU 2012 (???)

I honestly believe it is the stupid name that is killing them this time. Maybe they should just rebrand it?
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I'm not sure why you think there is "no way they sell to Apple" when Nintendo is a business. If the business is in trouble the investors will demand that they look for ways to unlock the company's value. Keep in mind that if enough investors demand it, they can force a vote on almost anything. Also, Apple has all the money.

On to your next comment, where's the Virtual Boy? Did you read the Iwata quotes? They're clearly considering abandoning the platform if it's a failure. This has been discussed a lot in the last year but keep in mind Nintendo is a business.

- Nintendo's corporate culture does not like taking losses and the Wii U is bringing down the company's profitability.

- Every Wii U sold is sold at a loss.

- The Wii U is selling extremely poorly.

- Nintendo was woefully unprepared for HD games and has delayed almost everything.

- Delayed games mean higher development costs.

- Higher development costs mean more games must be sold to break even.

- 3rd party devs need around 2 million games to break even and I estimated (in the past) that Nintendo would need around 1.5 million.

- Not enough 3rd party developers are selling games on the Wii to give them cash flow from games they didn't invest in.

In other words, if they sell more consoles, they take greater losses on the hardware but eventually can sell more of their games. If they sell less consoles they take less losses on the hardware but can't sell enough games to break even on development cost. At this point in time, it seems like they're selling just enough Wii U's to fuck up their earnings but not enough to drive software sales. Combine that with the fact that the console had a negative total sales number in Europe and how is this possibly a viable console?

They really needed to come out of the gate swinging with a bunch of big titles. I don't think Mario this holiday is going to save the Wii U.

One last thing, Iwata should go back to making Mario games and let someone else run the company. Only an incompetent CEO does some of the shit he's done recently. Notable is the announcement of the price drop so far out from the actual price cut itself. Second, this current statement where he's admitted that Nintendo may drop the Wii U if it doesn't perform well this holiday season. Who the hell's going to buy it now instead of waiting to see if they keep it? If anything, it's going to push people away from it. There's a reason that this kind of information is usually attained from leaks and rumors in most companies - because making it public knowledge is like shooting yourself in the foot.

 
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MetalSlugger said:
The only place I EVER see Blaster man post is in this thread whenever a new sales number comes out. It's pretty sad yet weirdly fascinating that he thinks anyone but him gives one flaming shit about how many systems were sold last quarter.
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Everytime I check this thread, this comment makes more and more sense. I'm going to add demented, obsessed, and creepy to this list.

 
This race to see how each company is going to get customers in such different ways is exciting to me. I'm going to laugh if people are going to avoid the PS4 because it doesn't play CD's and MP3's

.

Javery said:
So $300 for the 32GB console with New Super Mario Bros. U and New Super Luigi U? I'm finally going to cave. I'll pick up Zelda WW as well. My son is going to freak out.
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And I'm finding out about this now?!

This bundle seals it for me and made my day. So NES came with a Mario game, SNES comes with a Mario game, and now a Nintendo console with TWO Mario games and the ability to play all [most of] those past Mario games on consoles I use to play them on? For me, getting the Wii U would be like coming home from a 10 year trip in another country (in my case, Sony Land). Now I can move to Nintendo Land :p. I haven't been this excited since I heard Mega Man will be in the next Smash Bros. game.

I didn't like the "Wii" name but I don't mind Wii U (although it sounds like the noise of a police siren). Wii implies you need 2 or more players to use it whereas Wii U sounds more ... established?

 
Blaster man said:
I'm not sure why you think there is "no way they sell to Apple" when Nintendo is a business. If the business is in trouble the investors will demand that they look for ways to unlock the company's value. Keep in mind that if enough investors demand it, they can force a vote on almost anything. Also, Apple has all the money.
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The business as a whole is not in trouble though. One product is not currently meeting expectations and there is every reason to believe that they will eventually make money off of it given the company's history, the strong first party IP and the cheaper tech. They don't need to sell the most. Also, you don't have any idea what the governing documents of the company say so whether any investor demands would actually have merit are pure speculation. For all we know Yamauchi's shares could have a block on a change of control or something.

 
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Javery said:
The business as a whole is not in trouble though. One product is not currently meeting expectations and there is every reason to believe that they will eventually make money off of it given the company's history, the strong first party IP and the cheaper tech. They don't need to sell the most. Also, you don't have any idea what the governing documents of the company say so whether any investor demands would actually have merit are pure speculation. For all we know Yamauchi's shares could have a block on a change of control or something.
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True and I'm not even saying that Apple is trying to buy them, I'm saying that Apple SHOULD buy them because it would be good for Apple and probably good for Nintendo as well. If Apple (or someone else) came to them with an offer, they would at least have to consider it and bring it up to the board. I mean if it was an absurdly high offer I do think they would take it. Apple doesn't exactly have the best track record in buying companies though - rather they create their own competing brand. For example, they should have just purchased Pandora instead of making iTunes radio.

http://www.idownloadblog.com/2013/10/01/the-real-impact-of-apples-ios-7-controller-support/

http://www.theverge.com/2013/6/12/4421534/ios-7-to-include-standardized-game-controller-support

http://www.displaysearchblog.com/2013/10/in-2014-apple-will-once-again-rely-on-displays-for-innovation/

 
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Erad30 said:
Over 4 million in the first couple of days, Animal Crossing has sold over 5. They are fine.
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Correction: The 3DS is "fine", the Wii U is far from it. If the holiday sales and new games coming out don't massively boost sales, it is at great risk of falling to a distant 3rd place, since the true next-gen consoles are releasing in 2-3 weeks. Not sure if the 3DS is enough to keep Nintendo solid, but of course they're sitting on a fair amount of cash so its not at all critical at this time.

 
Cage017 said:
This race to see how each company is going to get customers in such different ways is exciting to me. I'm going to laugh if people are going to avoid the PS4 because it doesn't play CD's and MP3's

.

And I'm finding out about this now?!

This bundle seals it for me and made my day. So NES came with a Mario game, SNES comes with a Mario game, and now a Nintendo console with TWO Mario games and the ability to play all [most of] those past Mario games on consoles I use to play them on? For me, getting the Wii U would be like coming home from a 10 year trip in another country (in my case, Sony Land). Now I can move to Nintendo Land :p. I haven't been this excited since I heard Mega Man will be in the next Smash Bros. game.

I didn't like the "Wii" name but I don't mind Wii U (although it sounds like the noise of a police siren). Wii implies you need 2 or more players to use it whereas Wii U sounds more ... established?
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Yeah! It's gonna be exciting playing all kinds of games on the gamepad! :D/ Wii U's going to be my main console when I get it!

Wiiiiiii would like to playyy!!!!!!! :D

 
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Blaster man said:
True and I'm not even saying that Apple is trying to buy them, I'm saying that Apple SHOULD buy them because it would be good for Apple and probably good for Nintendo as well. If Apple (or someone else) came to them with an offer, they would at least have to consider it and bring it up to the board. I mean if it was an absurdly high offer I do think they would take it.
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There's far more to consider when proposing purchasing a company than just the intellectual properties that the company owns. The only reason why ANYONE ever proposed that Apple buy Nintendo is because they want to see Nintendo games on Apple hardware. In their minds they just want their favorite games to run on their favorite hardware. While an idealistic sentiment, it doesn't come close to taking the realities of the situation into account.

Apple is neither large enough or wealthy enough to purchase Nintendo in their current form. Disney would probably be wealthy enough, but Apple isn't even close. A lot of times companies get sold because the owners are looking to cash out, or the company has fallen on hard times and can be had for much less than it's actually worth. These scenarios don't apply for Apple and Nintendo. Nintendo is operating from a position of strength, with lots of extra cash in the bank. Even with some of their current difficulties with the Wii U, their company itself is quite healthy. And the current owners of Nintendo are very unlikely to want to sell. And they certainly wouldn't want to sell Nintendo to a foreign company.

That brings us to another difficulty. Most companies aren't courted by potential purchasers with wildly different corporate culture unless those purchasers fully intend to dismantle their new acquisition. Apple and Nintendo have very different corporate cultures. The two companies probably wouldn't work very well together. If Apple purchased Nintendo, they would probably end up dismantling the company and ruining everything that had made Nintendo great.

 
Richard Kain said:
That brings us to another difficulty. Most companies aren't courted by potential purchasers with wildly different corporate culture unless those purchasers fully intend to dismantle their new acquisition. Apple and Nintendo have very different corporate cultures. The two companies probably wouldn't work very well together. If Apple purchased Nintendo, they would probably end up dismantling the company and ruining everything that had made Nintendo great.
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I'm glad you said this first, because I was thinking the same exact thing when Blaster man first introduced the idea that Apple buys out Nintendo. Apple products and Nintendo products are so much different even from a simple consumer standpoint (Apple is considered upper echelon while Nintendo is family friendly and usually cheaper than the competition).

I would hate if Apple Elite-ified the Nintendo brand to a status symbol, as they have always been the accessible option for gaming. So in a word: No.

Not that any of this would actually happen outside of Fairytale land, just assuming if it did.

 
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Richard Kain said:
There's far more to consider when proposing purchasing a company than just the intellectual properties that the company owns. The only reason why ANYONE ever proposed that Apple buy Nintendo is because they want to see Nintendo games on Apple hardware. In their minds they just want their favorite games to run on their favorite hardware. While an idealistic sentiment, it doesn't come close to taking the realities of the situation into account.

Apple is neither large enough or wealthy enough to purchase Nintendo in their current form. Disney would probably be wealthy enough, but Apple isn't even close. A lot of times companies get sold because the owners are looking to cash out, or the company has fallen on hard times and can be had for much less than it's actually worth. These scenarios don't apply for Apple and Nintendo. Nintendo is operating from a position of strength, with lots of extra cash in the bank. Even with some of their current difficulties with the Wii U, their company itself is quite healthy. And the current owners of Nintendo are very unlikely to want to sell. And they certainly wouldn't want to sell Nintendo to a foreign company.

That brings us to another difficulty. Most companies aren't courted by potential purchasers with wildly different corporate culture unless those purchasers fully intend to dismantle their new acquisition. Apple and Nintendo have very different corporate cultures. The two companies probably wouldn't work very well together. If Apple purchased Nintendo, they would probably end up dismantling the company and ruining everything that had made Nintendo great.
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From time to time I notice people saying things about Apple's ability to purchase another company. Apple has ALL the money. I want Apple to buy Nintendo because I think that would drive additional revenue and increase my stock's price. Playing their games on iPhone would also be nice.

Nintendo's marketcap is 14.39 billion. If Apple gave them a 100% premium, which would be highly unusual, that would be just under 30 billion dollars. Apple has about 150 billion dollars in cash overseas sitting around being unproductive. Apple gains another 50 billion dollars a year in cash that isn't used (known as free cash flow).

Apple is in the enviable position of not knowing what to do with it's money to the point where an activist investor (Carl Icahn) bought billions of dollars of shares (equal to 5% of the float) a few months ago and is trying to get Apple to do some really stupid moves to enrich himself. Buying Nintendo would be much wiser than this:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/steveschaefer/2013/10/24/icahn-issues-letter-to-apples-tim-cook-wants-150b-buyback-immediately/

Disney has nowhere near this amount of cash. It's absurd to suggest as such.

http://blogs.wsj.com/cfo/2013/10/01/apple-now-holds-10-of-all-corporate-cash-moodys/

Billytwoshoes said:
I'm glad you said this first, because I was thinking the same exact thing when Blaster man first introduced the idea that Apple buys out Nintendo. Apple products and Nintendo products are so much different even from a simple consumer standpoint (Apple is considered upper echelon while Nintendo is family friendly and usually cheaper than the competition).

I would hate if Apple Elite-ified the Nintendo brand to a status symbol, as they have always been the accessible option for gaming. So in a word: No.

Not that any of this would actually happen outside of Fairytale land, just assuming if it did.
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I understand that some people hate Apple for some reason but I'm sure plenty more people would be happy and Apple's market is much larger than Nintendo. They could sell a lot more games and make many more games since risk would be much smaller with such a massive install base.

 
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Question:

I know it was mentioned in this thread (or the one about the bundle) but the Wii U that comes with NSBMU and Luigi U, are those games on discs or downloads?

 
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Blaster man said:
I understand that some people hate Apple for some reason but I'm sure plenty more people would be happy and Apple's market is much larger than Nintendo. They could sell a lot more games and make many more games since risk would be much smaller with such a massive install base.
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For the record I have no beef with Apple (I'm typing this on a Mac), I just don't think they would be a good match for Nintendo products. When was the last time you saw a discount or entry level Apple hardware product that appealed to the masses? Nintendo seems to market one of those every year at least.

Apple seems content to produce status symbol electronics, something that should not be applied to video games IMO.

 
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Blaster Man is like those blowhards on CNBC or the stock guys spreading rumors to help his stocks... he's been bad-mouthing Nintendo for almost a year, hoping to create enough angst and then he can profit by Apple buying them up... Classic.

Apple products are loved in Japan, but Nintendo is loved even more. I don't see that happening.

 
soonersfan60 said:
Blaster Man is like those blowhards on CNBC or the stock guys spreading rumors to help his stocks... he's been bad-mouthing Nintendo for almost a year, hoping to create enough angst and then he can profit by Apple buying them up... Classic.

Apple products are loved in Japan, but Nintendo is loved even more. I don't see that happening.
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Okay this one had me laughing! You can't be serious.
 
soonersfan60 said:
Blaster Man is like those blowhards on CNBC or the stock guys spreading rumors to help his stocks... he's been bad-mouthing Nintendo for almost a year, hoping to create enough angst and then he can profit by Apple buying them up... Classic.

Apple products are loved in Japan, but Nintendo is loved even more. I don't see that happening.
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It's REALLY hard for corporate takeovers in Japan. It's almost impossible.

 
Yes, King, that all is part of the reason why I said I don't see that happening... Nintendo would have to agree. I don't think their corporate culture or the public would let them do that unless it was perhaps a dire rescue situation... which it's not and likely never will be.

 
It was from Gamestop. And I noticed that the video apps (Netflix, Amazon, etc) showed redownload/already purchased. So is there an answer to my actual question?

 
Since that stuff is tied to the system, anything already downloaded can be re-downloaded. Yes, including games.

Not sure about Netflix, Hulu, or anything with a subscription, though.
 
Pretty sure you have to be logged in with the original account to redownload paid software.

EDIT: Wow, totally wrong. I was able to redownload my purchases with my wife's account. Cool beans.
 
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DNukem170 said:
Since that stuff is tied to the system, anything already downloaded can be re-downloaded. Yes, including games.

Not sure about Netflix, Hulu, or anything with a subscription, though.
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Right, I was looking for an easy way to see if there were any previous downloads. I don't think there are, but it'd be nice to be sure.

 
jza1218 said:
On the upside, they never registered it with Club Nintendo, so I'll at least get the 160 coins.
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Not bad, I got my kid a DSi off craigslist a couple years ago and the people left a bunch of games on it, $1 credit, and hadn't registered it. Their kid was getting a 3ds so they must not have known about the ability to transfer.
 
I am on the fence about getting a Wii U and could use some input. The new Mario/Luigi Bundle has me tempted to make the plunge but the bleak outlook for Wii U has me a bit hesitant (600,000 global sales in a 6 month period is terrible). I have all the other major systems and have the PS4 and Xbone preordered. In general, I only ever play first party titles on Nintendo consoles.

For those who own the Wii U and current gen consoles, how often do you find yourself playing the Wii U? Are you happy with the flow of games for the system (especially first party)? Do you find the multiplatform games to be any better on the Wii U over the other consoles? Etc.

Thanks in advance.
 
NJMane - Pikmin 3 is incredible (I beat it). Super Mario 3D World looks to be incredible (I played it at PAX). Throw in the two NSMB games in that bundle, maybe Zelda, and whatever else Nintendo has coming next year (Smash Bros., Kart, etc) and I think that alone justifies the purchase. Anything beyond that is gravy - but that's just my opinion.
 
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Pikmin 3 is really good.
Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate is really good, but it takes some amount of commitment to get into.

NSMBU is pretty good, but you might be hesitant to play it if you played NSMB2 recently, despite NSMBU being vastly superior.

NSLU is definitely better than NSLU, but it is quite a bit harder.

Wind Waker HD is...well, Wind Waker in HD.  It's definitely better paced due to the Quick Sail, and looks better than it does in screenshots/videos, but it is ultimately just a remake.

I've heard that AC4, Batman: AO, Splinter Cell, Deus Ex and Rayman Legends also run really well on Wii U, at least compared to their PS3/360 counterparts, having less glitches, particular game-breaking ones.

 
NJMane said:
I am on the fence about getting a Wii U and could use some input. The new Mario/Luigi Bundle has me tempted to make the plunge but the bleak outlook for Wii U has me a bit hesitant (600,000 global sales in a 6 month period is terrible). I have all the other major systems and have the PS4 and Xbone preordered. In general, I only ever play first party titles on Nintendo consoles.

For those who own the Wii U and current gen consoles, how often do you find yourself playing the Wii U? Are you happy with the flow of games for the system (especially first party)? Do you find the multiplatform games to be any better on the Wii U over the other consoles? Etc.

Thanks in advance.
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No offense, but why do global sales have any impact on how much fun you'd have with a system?

I use my Wii U almost every day since it has the best versions of Hulu+/Netflix, and ever since Pikmin 3 in August there has been a great game released every 2-3 weeks, mostly first party. I'm anticipating a dry spell after SM3DW but it should pick up in February with Donkey Kong and then the real hot shit exclusives (SSB, Mario Kart, X) will start coming out.

 
Corvin said:
Not 'fun' but sales absolutely impact third party development. Not much fun to be had during droughts between first party releases.
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Not just that, no one wants to feel like they overpaid and Iwata as said that if this holiday season isn't successful for the Wii U that it will likely be discontinued. That means that if you pay $300 for that now, you'll be buying into a system with no future games. It also means that you might be able to find it for 100 or 150 in a few months.

 
Corvin said:
Not 'fun' but sales absolutely impact third party development. Not much fun to be had during droughts between first party releases.
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Since when has Nintendo had great third party support? SNES?

Blaster man said:
Not just that, no one wants to feel like they overpaid and Iwata as said that if this holiday season isn't successful for the Wii U that it will likely be discontinued. That means that if you pay $300 for that now, you'll be buying into a system with no future games. It also means that you might be able to find it for 100 or 150 in a few months.
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Do you honestly believe that will happen?

 
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