Wii U - General Discussion Thread

Why does this even matter to you? lol. If you don't like to collect games thats fine. No one is forcing you. Some people do however and thats not a problem.

 
Rayman Legends Sells Best on Wii U in Opening Week
by Tom Malina - September 2, 2013 - 2:22 P.M.
Total Comments: 3 Source: GFK Chart-Track http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p/software/uk/latest/index_test.jsp&ct=110032 and Eurogamer http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-09-02-rayman-legends-outsells-origins-week-one-by-20-per-cent-in-uk-chart

The draw of Murfy's GamePad antics proves to be too much to resist.


Rayman Legends has sold more copies on Wii U than on any other platform since going on sale on August 30 in the UK, according to the latest Chart-Track figures.

The Wii U version reportedly accounted for about 45% of the retail sales of the limbless legend's latest platformer, which was formerly pegged as a Wii U exclusive until it was delayed earlier this year to enable multi-platform support.

By comparison, the Xbox 360 version made up 30% of the game's sales, whilst the PS3 edition took 24% and the PC version a meagre 1%. These statistics do not factor in the title's digital sales on any of the systems.

Overall, the opening week sales of Legends in the UK were around a 20% increase on the first-week sales of the previous entry in the series, Rayman Origins, which was released in late 2011.

Rayman Legends will launch across North America tomorrow, September 3.
 
That's nice but I finally canceled my Newegg $40 preorder for it a week or two ago.  I'll get it for Wii U when it is cheap - but they lost my day 1 purchase when they delayed it for multiplatform.  It wasn't even so much that they took an exclusive away from the Wii U but that they delayed it to do so.  I could have used a game on the Wii U in March/April when this was supposed to come out.  Now I have Pikmin 3 and games for other systems will start pouring forth soon so I'm on no hurry to play it now.

I played the Wii U Mario 3D at PAX and it is pretty fun.  Yeah, it is a "rush to the end" Mario and not a Mario 64/Sunshine exploration game (which I would have loved) but it is fun nonetheless.  The cat suits are really cool and the game is stunning in HD.  The animations on all the characters/abilities is great, but the cat suits are just amazing - especially when you climb walls and such.  Nintendo has made the transition to HD with no problem in all aspects.  It isn't just a Wii game with HD textures - there's so much more to the upgrade than that.

Oh yeah, I also played Wind Waker but only because it was part of the "deal" to get a Link T-shirt.  I had to wait 2 hours to watch my son play it for 10 minutes ;).  It looks nice but not too different from what I remember the Gamecube version looking like.  Of course it has no jaggies - but the simple textures/bright colors did a good job of masking the standard def in the GC version and it looks no different in HD (except with sharp edges).  And perhaps it runs a bit smoother?  I played the GC one so long ago but I seem to remember some slowdown.  They did add some sort of Mii Verse connectivity in the form of messages in a bottle.  You find those on the shore and at sea and they have notes from other players.  So that is kind of cool.  The guy explaining the demo said it was still early (?) and he wasn't sure what else would be changed/added.  But he did mention the streamlined triforce quest at the end and the faster sailing.  And apparently there is some way to always have the wind behind you no matter what direction you face.

Unfortunately Wind Waker is the only Zelda game I ever beat and I don't feel the need to replay it so I'll probably pass on this unless I get it cheap down the road.  I should really play the 3DS remake as I never even played the N64 games.  (FYI - I played the original at a friend's house in college one night and that was it till I got a Gamecube).

I did not get to play Bayonetta 2 since they were giving away a T-shirt for playing which meant waiting 2+ hours and my son had no interest in that (and yet I waited 2 hours to play Titanfall with him - go figure ;)).

The Nintendo booth was pretty busy all show long though - lots of interest in the games.  The Donkey Kong game always had long lines too so I didn't try that.  They also had Wonderful 101 and, for some reason, Pikmin 3.  They did have a cool Olimar (I think) with Pikmin statue there.  I'll post a picture later.  3DS was definitely deemphasized in favor of the Wii U as they had those down in a lower level hallway type place and not on the main floor at all.  The new 3DS Zelda was there and I totally forgot to check that out - oh well...

 
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io said:
That's nice but I finally canceled my Newegg $40 preorder for it a week or two ago. I'll get it for Wii U when it is cheap - but they lost my day 1 purchase when they delayed it for multiplatform. It wasn't even so much that they took an exclusive away from the Wii U but that they delayed it to do so. I could have used a game on the Wii U in March/April when this was supposed to come out. Now I have Pikmin 3 and games for other systems will start pouring forth soon so I'm on no hurry to play it now.

I played the Wii U Mario 3D at PAX and it is pretty fun. Yeah, it is a "rush to the end" Mario and not a Mario 64/Sunshine exploration game (which I would have loved) but it is fun nonetheless. The cat suits are really cool and the game is stunning in HD. The animations on all the characters/abilities is great, but the cat suits are just amazing - especially when you climb walls and such. Nintendo has made the transition to HD with no problem in all aspects. It isn't just a Wii game with HD textures - there's so much more to the upgrade than that.

Oh yeah, I also played Wind Waker but only because it was part of the "deal" to get a Link T-shirt. I had to wait 2 hours to watch my son play it for 10 minutes ;). It looks nice but not too different from what I remember the Gamecube version looking like. Of course it has no jaggies - but the simple textures/bright colors did a good job of masking the standard def in the GC version and it looks no different in HD (except with sharp edges). And perhaps it runs a bit smoother? I played the GC one so long ago but I seem to remember some slowdown. They did add some sort of Mii Verse connectivity in the form of messages in a bottle. You find those on the shore and at sea and they have notes from other players. So that is kind of cool. The guy explaining the demo said it was still early (?) and he wasn't sure what else would be changed/added. But he did mention the streamlined triforce quest at the end and the faster sailing. And apparently there is some way to always have the wind behind you no matter what direction you face.

Unfortunately Wind Waker is the only Zelda game I ever beat and I don't feel the need to replay it so I'll probably pass on this unless I get it cheap down the road. I should really play the 3DS remake as I never even played the N64 games. (FYI - I played the original at a friend's house in college one night and that was it till I got a Gamecube).

I did not get to play Bayonetta 2 since they were giving away a T-shirt for playing which meant waiting 2+ hours and my son had no interest in that (and yet I waited 2 hours to play Titanfall with him - go figure ;)).

The Nintendo booth was pretty busy all show long though - lots of interest in the games. The Donkey Kong game always had long lines too so I didn't try that. They also had Wonderful 101 and, for some reason, Pikmin 3. They did have a cool Olimar (I think) with Pikmin statue there. I'll post a picture later. 3DS was definitely deemphasized in favor of the Wii U as they had those down in a lower level hallway type place and not on the main floor at all. The new 3DS Zelda was there and I totally forgot to check that out - oh well...
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cool insite on pax. im actually going to buy wwhd. just to be clear i have no desire to play through it again, but that special edition figure is to hard to pass on. its going to sit sealed for future trade fodder. i beat WW 4 times on GC so im good. Mario 3dw & zelda 3ds will tide me over on the nintendo front untill mario kart 8 & smash u next year. nothing else interests me. ill get squeeze in my nintendo fix inbetween my next gen gaming.

 
Hey, IO... Did the Nintendo guy say anything about new dungeons in WW?  I know he said more may be added, but if he's not saying it now then I would say 'No'. (There were supposedly 2 dungeons left out of the original GC version... not sure how far along they were.)

 
Unless Nintendo is trolling us, there are no new dungeons. I believe the cut Wind Waker dungeons were reused in Twilight Princess.
 
62t said:
That will have the same effect as your dad giving you his Atari and Amiga collection.
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You kids with your dads leaving Atari collections to you. Sheesh...

Deader2818 said:
Yes, which was freaking awesome.
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My dad sold (or more likely gave away) my entire Atari/Colecovision collection without asking me about it first. I think he really gave it away but he told me he sold it to make it seem like he got some sort of deal. Though I think he said $50. That was for the system (at that point I just had the Colecovision with the Atari game adapter) plus 50+ games.

As for WW, no he didn't say anything about dungeons. But like I said, he did imply that nothing was final yet.

 
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TimboSliceGB said:
http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/09/03/bethesda-nintendo-needs-better-support-for-third-party-devs

yikes another dev saying wii u is under powered
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Who cares, I watched their interview... pointless as far as Nintendo is concern because you know how many games they have developed for Nintendo?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bethesda_Game_Studios

Plus... have you seen modded Skyrim on PC? They didn't have a problem developing it for PS360 :)

Anyway, they have not develop anything for Nintendo, they just don't do Nintendo which is perfectly OK. I am in the mindset that developers should be able to develop for the platform they want, not have to do multiplat everything which the industry pretty much forced them to with the current big budget games often have and console makers moving to a more homogeneous hardware platform.

 
gmsick said:
the producer confirmed a while ago there are no new dungeons.

http://kotaku.com/streamlined-triforce-quest-no-new-dungeons-for-wind-wa-513413716

new features are hero mode (double damage no hearts), quick sail, tingle island folded into main quest, tingle bottles for miiverse & quicker triforce quest.
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This for me makes it worth it alone (though quick sail is freaking sweet). Quicker Triforce? Meh, I actually liked exploring around hunting for them, even the ones you had to fish for. But if the Tingle Island part implies not needing a billion fuck ing rupees to pay tingle to translate the maps... :bouncy:

 
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(Referring to the Bethesda dev link) Exactly, wasabi5858 - there's another dev that simply thinks it would have been convenient if Nintendo had "listened" to them and made the Wii U have the exact same architecture/specs as the X1 and PS4.  Well, duh, of course that would make porting games easier.  It would also have doomed Nintendo for sure because, think about it Timbo, would Sony and MS fanboys all of a sudden jump over to Nintendo if that happened?  Hell no - it would be pointless.  They'd still stick with what they are familiar with.  Nintendo went in a different direction (yet again) because it was really the only way for them to go to differentiate themselves.  If that means no (buggy half-assed) Skyrim port, well, then, so be it :roll:.

 
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Nintendo did listen/get advice from third parties time around though.  Bethesda wasn't one of them, of course, because, publishing wise, Bethesda doesn't produce a lot of games, especially ones of merit (Note:  I'm talking about an overall # of games here, not just Elder Scrolls and Fallout).  It doesn't guarantee they'll get everyone aboard though, as EA has continued their insanity of F2P and multiplayer on every title they release.  Also, some third parties just want a paycheck from console manufacturers, nothing more.  It's easy to spot who those are, thankfully.

The Wii U update should be hitting sometime this month.  I know of one thing in it that got pushed back to a later date, but before Christmas.  The loading times and other things should be addressed this month though.

 
Picked up Rayman Legends today.  Either I was the only person who preordered it or everyone else already picked theirs up; my vote's on the former.  Ubisoft really shot themselves in the foot by delaying it so close to the holiday season.  Too bad...the game is amazing.

 
io said:
(Referring to the Bethesda dev link) Exactly, wasabi5858 - there's another dev that simply thinks it would have been convenient if Nintendo had "listened" to them and made the Wii U have the exact same architecture/specs as the X1 and PS4. Well, duh, of course that would make porting games easier. It would also have doomed Nintendo for sure because, think about it Timbo, would Sony and MS fanboys all of a sudden jump over to Nintendo if that happened? Hell no - it would be pointless. They'd still stick with what they are familiar with. Nintendo went in a different direction (yet again) because it was really the only way for them to go to differentiate themselves. If that means no (buggy half-assed) Skyrim port, well, then, so be it :roll:.
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fanboys don't sell systems casual gamers is what pushes out systems this day and age. Till this day i don't understand why nintendo don't put any money into marketing the wii u even at launch we seen very few ads for it. i would say in couple weeks we will be seeing x1/ps4 ads every other tv ad. im not a nintendo hater i have a 3ds that i play more then other systems with that said im very sad how the wii u has turned out after a year.

 
Right - and casuals that already play Madden or CoD on 360 would not have picked up a Nintendo system if it had the same specs.  They would have stuck with MS.   I meant "fanboy" for those types - the ones with all their friends playing CoD online every weekend and whatnot.  I've run into these types while travelling for work - guys even my age or older.  I guess they'd be "casual fanboys" and there would be nothing Nintendo could do spec-wise that would make them switch.

Bottom line - if Nintendo had pumped out a MS/Sony clone-box they would be in as bad if not worse shape than they are now (plus losing money on the hardware even more than with the Wii U).

 
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MetalSlugger said:
Picked up Rayman Legends today. Either I was the only person who preordered it or everyone else already picked theirs up; my vote's on the former. Ubisoft really shot themselves in the foot by delaying it so close to the holiday season. Too bad...the game is amazing.
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The demo was amazing, but after Ubi delayed six months it so they can make it multi-platform, I cancelled my preorder. Had it been delayed a month or two before it was to come out (much like the first time it was delayed), that's one thing, but to delay it two weeks beforehand when the game was reported as finished? Screw that. I'll wait for a price drop, no matter how bad I want to play it.

 
Hell I just don't have time for much new right now period, I seem to mostly have time for Animal Crossing lately and that's because I get to work like 40 minutes early and get a session in before I start. Definitely waiting on a price/drop good sale for Rayman.

 
I did pick up Rayman yesterday and... well, this is two games in a row where I've run into issues.

The Wii U isn't doing well, that's pretty clear. However, it shouldn't be this difficult to find games. For both Splinter Cell and Rayman, I had to go to THREE stores before I found one that was carrying either title, which sort of makes it seem like the 'third parties don't sell on Nintendo' a self-fulfilling prophecy. First party stuff like Pikmin and Luigi U... no problem. However, Wal-Mart and Best Buy were not stocking either Splinter Cell or Rayman. Toys R Us only gets about 2 copies of each new Wii U game now, and the guy working there always makes a point of letting me know I'm the only person that bought a specific title (You're welcome, one copy of Game & Wario!). Gamestop had no pre-orders for Rayman, and I bought the ONLY COPY they received for the Wii U.

This is all anecdotal, sure, but I fear that the bigger threat to the Wii U this fall isn't new systems, but the lack of shelf space. Stores seem to simply not be stocking new third party Wii U titles, which is an issue. It's tough to sell things when they're just... not there. I understand that businesses are still hurting from over-ordering launch titles (Hi, 50 copies of WipeOut!), but it amazes me that it's this difficult to locate new Wii U titles on release day... even if I do appear to be the entirety of the Wii U market in my town. :lol:

 
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Someone did mention that Rayman Legends' early figures showed the Wii U version selling better than others. Perhaps in addition to shortage of product, they actually also sold out?
 
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theflicker said:
Someone did mention that Rayman Legends' early figures showed the Wii U version selling better than others. Perhaps in addition to shortage of product, they actually also sold out?
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Since the US vs. EU thing was already covered (and, really, it still didn't do impressive numbers regardless)... it's definitely just not being carried. Wal-Mart doesn't have a tag for Rayman (yesterday OR today) and they also have never put out Splinter Cell. Best Buy, if they have it, never put it on the floor. The Wii U section is so jam packed with launch shit there (no joke, 15 copies of WipeOut! and probably the same for Assassin's Creed) that even Pikmin is only stocked in the special 'new release' section.

And GameStop flat out told me that they received one Wii U copy. One. Total.

I just... I mean, I get it. I do. I'm just floored that finding copies of relatively (for the timeframe, anyway) high-profile releases are this difficult to find on release day. I'm not joking when I say that if I wanted a copy of Splinter Cell Wii U *without* that damn GameStop branding, my option was the TWO copies that TRU got. Period. Brick and mortar, anyway. It's not like I live in the middle of nowhere, either. I want to support the Wii U and third party efforts on it, but I'm sensing that's going to become very difficult in the months to come unless I start ordering online (and there's, uh, third party efforts left to support. Sigh.).

 
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Wii U:        $299

PS4:          $399

Xbox One: $499

I'm eagerly awaiting the Black Friday sales to see what, if anything, retailers are going to offer to get people to buy one over the other.

This Wii U price was what I was waiting for since Day 1 although I'm a little sad that Wind Waker is part of the new bundle. I guess it makes sense since they included a Zelda collection on the Gamecube, but I was hoping for a new title entirely rather than a remake/remaster.

Since I don't own a Wii (my household didn't have DSL until years later) I will have no problems finding a game to play on Wii U. Between Wii/Wii U requests and my excessive backlog of PS2/GC/XBox/PS3 games, trade sites and lowball attendees are going to love me if I get a Wii U and plan on making shelf space.

BTW, has the Virtual Console been fully updated so every game works on the Wii U? If not, did they announce when it will be completed?

 
Just to comment on Legends in stores... when I went to get my Vita copy I had the reverse experience, the guy working pulled out a Wii U copy and seemed unaware it was even on the Vita. Not sure how you can work at a game store and not be up to speed on stuff like that.
 
johnnypark said:
Just to comment on Legends in stores... when I went to get my Vita copy I had the reverse experience, the guy working pulled out a Wii U copy and seemed unaware it was even on the Vita. Not sure how you can work at a game store and not be up to speed on stuff like that.
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MY BAD JUST GRABBED THE FIRST BLUE CASE I SAW LOLOLLLZ

WOULD YOU LIKE TO PREORDER ANYTHING ELSE THAT I WILL SCREW UP ON LAUNCH DAY

 
renique46 said:
You're gonna be sorely disappointed then
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Yeah, PS4 will have been out for 2 weeks and X1 for 1 week. There won't be any deals on those. Maybe he meant next Black Friday ;).

With the Wii U, I think the Zelda bundle/price drop is already the "deal" for this Fall. Though perhaps the older deluxe model will have something thrown in or maybe a gift card for BF. I could see that.

 
io said:
Yeah, PS4 will have been out for 2 weeks and X1 for 1 week. There won't be any deals on those. Maybe he meant next Black Friday ;).

With the Wii U, I think the Zelda bundle/price drop is already the "deal" for this Fall. Though perhaps the older deluxe model will have something thrown in or maybe a gift card for BF. I could see that.
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It would be a nice gesture if they threw in a game this holiday but I don't see it happening. They probably consider the FTP stuff as a free game...

 
io said:
Yeah, PS4 will have been out for 2 weeks and X1 for 1 week. There won't be any deals on those. Maybe he meant next Black Friday ;).

With the Wii U, I think the Zelda bundle/price drop is already the "deal" for this Fall. Though perhaps the older deluxe model will have something thrown in or maybe a gift card for BF. I could see that.
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exactly. as far as the wii u is concerned the price drop is probably gonna be this years "deal" unless there is a slight chance you get a retailer to throw in an extra game to the already established bundles out at the time.

 
johnnypark said:
Just to comment on Legends in stores... when I went to get my Vita copy I had the reverse experience, the guy working pulled out a Wii U copy and seemed unaware it was even on the Vita. Not sure how you can work at a game store and not be up to speed on stuff like that.
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Sometimes they seem very unawares, I remember pre-ordering Xenoblade and the dumbass asked me if I wanted to pre-order it on the PS3....

 
He lost me on this part:

Meanwhile, the Nintendo 2DS will come out and will probably sell quite well at first thanks to a well-timed Pokemon release. But all the 2DS really is is an admission that the 3DS is ultimately a failure.
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No, it is not. Oh, wow, it is tracking 20% behind the DS at this point. Big whoop - that thing printed money. So maybe the 3DS prints slightly less money but it is ubiquitous now. After a slow start, I see every kid with one now.

He might have valid points about the Wii U but if it all comes from this same logic, then, well, he's speculating as much as anyone else.

 
io said:
He lost me on this part:

No, it is not. Oh, wow, it is tracking 20% behind the DS at this point. Big whoop - that thing printed money. So maybe the 3DS prints slightly less money but it is ubiquitous now. After a slow start, I see every kid with one now.

He might have valid points about the Wii U but if it all comes from this same logic, then, well, he's speculating as much as anyone else.
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I agree with you. I just don't see where he's coming from with the 3DS. I realize that it's the job of every business to "grow" but ultimately no one can grow infinitely and not every product will be as successful as the previous product. 20% lower adoption is actually a really good number considering the jump doesn't seem as big as the one from GBA to DS.

 
It's funny how he even openly states it in his article, but you can practically replace the word Nintendo with either Sony or Microsoft, and it's basically the same point and predictions (minus the IP mentions, of course):

Nintendo’s greatest weakness is the illusion (bolstered by years of reality) that they have years to figure out their competition and outlast them. They do not. Apple and all the various Android OEMs release new hardware every single year — if not more often. This will ultimately end the successful runs of Sony and Microsoft in the gaming space as well, unless they change course.
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So, basically the article heading should read: "The Death of Traditional Dedicated Consoles Has Been Greatly Under-Exaggerated." Hard to take such a strong point seriously when its read like that, fun banter at the least.

 
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Billytwoshoes said:
It's funny how he even openly states it in his article, but you can practically replace the word Nintendo with either Sony or Microsoft, and it's basically the same point and predictions (minus the IP mentions, of course):

So, basically the article heading should read: "The Death of Traditional Dedicated Consoles Has Been Greatly Under-Exaggerated." Hard to take such a strong point seriously when its read like that, fun banter at the least.
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I agree with this in the general sense but if he was specifically talking about Wii U (as io mentioned) he'd be making a good point. The problem with Wii U is that it looks like they're trying to compete with the iPad. I know because when they announced it two years ago and before they I read the articles about it, that's what I thought it was.

It looks like they saw that tablets were taking off and decided to try to get in on that market. Obviously if that was the plan they fucked up pretty badly since they didn't make a tablet at all. I really think they would have been better off doing apps for iPad and Android tablets and including a controller. They could have done two bundles, one with a Nexus 7 for $350 and one without for $150. I've said this many times and always have people angry at me for the idea but most people would rather have a real tablet that can be divorced from the console and lets face it, Google is able to produce much better equipment for a lot less. Somehow their economies of scale allow them to have memory, processors, RAM, etc and sell it at a profit for $200.

If they hard partnered with google, they probably could have made a hell of a deal with them and talk about a good way to get into the 21st century...

 
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Nintendo is not trying to compete with the fucking iPad.  They were doing touch gaming years before anyone was offering touch devices to the public, and two screen play since the GC/GBA link era.  The Wii U is an amalgam of almost everything they've ever put into a product; an evolution of what they think hardware should be.  I'm not saying that the strategy will work out or that they don't need to get with the times; I'm just sick of the iPad/smartphone competition angle because it's a lazy comparison that doesn't take into account Nintendo's product design history.

I vividly remember how everyone thought the original DS was a fad and that it would bottom out when the PSP was released.  Now you can't turn a corner without seeing someone with a handheld touch device in their hands.  Nintendo was way ahead of the curve on that one.

 
MetalSlugger said:
Nintendo is not trying to compete with the fucking iPad. They were doing touch gaming years before anyone was offering touch devices to the public, and two screen play since the GC/GBA link era. The Wii U is an amalgam of almost everything they've ever put into a product; an evolution of what they think hardware should be. I'm not saying that the strategy will work out or that they don't need to get with the times; I'm just sick of the iPad/smartphone competition angle because it's a lazy comparison that doesn't take into account Nintendo's product design history.

I vividly remember how everyone thought the original DS was a fad and that it would bottom out when the PSP was released. Now you can't turn a corner without seeing someone with a handheld touch device in their hands. Nintendo was way ahead of the curve on that one.
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First off, the GC/GBA connection was at best marginally two screen play. I had a GC and GBA SP and frankly it wasn't "2 screen play" in the way that the Wii U is. It was never really integrated in the same way and of course the Dreamcast had something similar in function to that. I'm not sure if the DS is the first touch screen gaming device in history but I'd wager it wasn't, however I'm not going to google it so I'll give you that one.

That said, it's all a bit outside the point. Being first or not is irrelevant to what they're trying to compete with. You say that they're not trying to compete with tablets but it certainly looks a lot like that from any outside observer, especially now that they've apparently been looking at compatibility with smartphone apps. Regardless, from the outside observer it has the appearance of a tablet and the outside observer makes up the majority of the casuals market which will be needed to make or break any game system. When a person with no knowledge of this thing sees a commercial and all it shows is the "tablet" and tv, they think "Why do I need that when I've got an iPad?"

So there's 2 things here. 1. They're apparently looking into mobile apps being ported over (I doubt that developers will spend the resources with such a small install base unless it's a simple port) and 2. It's got the appearance through both advertisements and in store displays that it's nothing more than a Mario tablet.

Lastly and this is fairly speculative but there's a chance that Apple will put out a controller in the future for their Apple TV. When (not if) that happens, it's going to spell the end of any console system that uses the TV as it's display that isn't already huge success. It will completely disrupt and frankly devastate the weaker end of the console market (the Wii U in this case). It will have compatibility with iOS devices people already have. It's going to be $99 and the controller will allow on screen play for any of the apps (and new apps made for it) you already own. When you think about it, most people here want to play huge games that are massive experiences but when you have the option of spending $50 on one game or $50 on 50 games, most people are going to buy 50 games for $50 even if most are smaller experiences. I think it's going to be looked at as "good enough" by many people and that's where the market disruption comes from - the casual market is going to be devastated. Most will be out of the console market for good and of those that stay I really doubt that many are going to buy the current Nintendo iteration as their secondary console. Again, that's very speculative but I believe it would be a mistake to underestimate the power that an Apple "game console" would have. There's a reason why BlackBerry and Nokia turned to shit over night. You need look no further than around the iPhone launch to see what people were saying about the staying power of BlackBerry. They had a 90% market share after all.

edit:

This. http://macdailynews.com/2007/02/12/rim_co_ceo_doesnt_see_threat_from_apples_iphone/

 
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Yes, but according to many people on here and professional observers as well, Nintendo did not capture the casual market with the Wii U like they did with the Wii and, in fact, such a thing might not be possible any more with the iPhone/iPads being such a big thing now.  So any Apple controller/TV thing that is just a step up from iPad will be more an extension of that market and not really take away from the Wii U.  The Wii itself lost that market a few years back when its sales started to slow dramatically.  Nintendo had to shift away from that lightning-in-a-bottle that was the Wii/motion control and try something different.  The Wii U may very well be back to Gamecube territory for Nintendo, and I'm fine with that.  As long as they have a strong and very successful handheld (as they currently do despite that article calling it a failure), they can go on for quite a while as long as they aren't losing money on the home console.  I don't think it is unreasonable for the Wii U to become mildly profitable for them in a year or two when they have some of their big games out.  That's not at all the same as it being more successful than the Wii - just that is isn't losing money any more as it is now.

As you said yourself, the measure of success does not always have to be infinite growth.  They can carve out a space for themselves and remain profitable without always growing forever.  Endless growth is the ideology of the cancer cell.  I know why it is obsessed over by people like Pachter, because to them it is all about stock prices, which require growth to increase.  But for Nintendo itself and for gamers, none of that matters.  (Yes, of course there are people within Nintendo who obsess over stock price as is it is their job - but I mean the devs and creative types who are the soul of the company).

 
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I agree with much of what you said but my point that BlackBerry (formerly RIM) had 90% market share and saw "no threat" from Apple's iPhone is that these kinds of entrenched companies can be destroyed almost over night by a market disruption they didn't see coming.  Now maybe Nintendo can eek out a profit with the Wii U in a few years like you're predicting but that's a far cry from breaking even on all the previously sold consoles they lost money on and just because they are able to make a small profit on the hardware eventually doesn't mean that the software will be profitable.  With higher software development costs and a smaller install base, Nintendo might run into the situation where they're closing internal studios that are unprofitable and reducing 1st party game development to only the AAA's like most other studios have done during the HD era.  Nintendo being "behind" doesn't mean that the same forces that pulled on the rest of the industry won't impact them.  They certainly don't seem to have learned from the rest of the industry given their "HD is harder and more expensive than we expected" comments a few months ago.

If the Wii U is still a huge failure after 4-5 years, it may end up being their final home console.  Nintendo has a lot of money so they would probably have one more in them no matter how poorly the Wii U does.  If that console does poorly too then I don't think there'd be one after that (aside from handhelds).

At some point we're talking so far into the future (2 consoles out) that it's almost impossible to predict what will happen.  For example, a lot of people are predicting that in the future cell phones will be powerful enough that people won't even have desktop computers any more.  You would just dock it into a docking station and that would connect to your monitor, keyboard, mouse, etc (similar to laptops today).  For all we know the Xbox One 2 or Xbox One 3 could be a phone that's your Windows PC, cell phone, and Xbox.

In other words, I don't think it's fair to say that Nintendo will be around in the future home console market just because they're there now, they've always been there, and they've got a ton of cash.  I think over the next 15 years we're going to see some huge changes and Nintendo will need to adopt.

edit: Keep in mind Moore's Law has more (pun not intended) or less been accurate.  In 15 years time we should see computing power double 10 more times.  Keeping in mind that this is an exponential increase (double today then double that number, then double that one, and so on), it's almost impossible to imagine what will happen by then.  Part of the reason technology is increasing at such a rapid speed when compared to the past is because the doubling of computing speed is doubling numbers that are so much larger than they ever were before.  Here's an interesting article on it if you have the time.  http://www.kurzweilai.net/the-law-of-accelerating-returns

I'm not sure if I can believe everything in it but for the purpose of my reply here, the most important part is the grain of rice on a chess board story and how that relates to our current computer speeds.  In other words, the doubling is going to result in some outrageous performance increases.

 
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Thing is, though, pretty much every console except the PS2 and Wii in the last 15 years has started slow. Hell, the PS3 took, what, 3 years to get going?

I will believe Nintendo's downfall when I see it. And then I will no longer be a gamer. Especially if they go to Apple.

Also, in regards to the Rayman Legends conversation from before, both my local TRU and Target have several copies of Rayman.
 
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Rumors have Nintendo revealing the new Zelda sometime after the Wind Waker HD launch.

I can see them doing a direct a month or so after release, showing a recap/sales numbers of Wind Waker and a trailer of the new Zelda.

If they can release Smash Bros, Mario Kart, and Zelda in 2014 that would be epic.  Not to mention Bayonetta 2 and Xenoblade HD.

It's been an inexcusably long drought for the Wii U, but they have an opportunity to do with the Wii U what they are doing with the 3DS. 

 
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AFRO insomniac said:
Rumors have Nintendo revealing the new Zelda sometime after the Wind Waker HD launch.

I can see them doing a direct a month or so after release, showing a recap/sales numbers of Wind Waker and a trailer of the new Zelda.

If they can release Smash Bros, Mario Kart, and Zelda in 2014 that would be epic. Not to mention Bayonetta 2 and Xenoblade HD.

It's been an inexcusably long drought for the Wii U, but they have an opportunity to do with the Wii U what they are doing with the 3DS.
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The could make it epic by doing a Christmas Day Nintendo Direct to announce the next Zelda.

Anyway, they are setting themselves up for a crazy 2014 if the cards line up. Ideally they could have Mario Kart and Yarn Yoshi in the spring, Bayonetta in the summer, and Smash Bros and X in the fall. Throw in a surprise Zelda, Wave Race, and Star Fox (or at least 1 out of 3). It probably won't be until 2015 but the SMT/Fire Emblem game could be on the horizon as well.

 
If the X and SMT/Fire Emblem games end up being good, those along with Pikmin 3, some of the VC stuff (like Earthbound which I bought but have yet to play), and a few staples like SSB, Zelda, Mario Kart (and hopefully a Mario 64/Sunshine style Mario game) are all the games I really need to justify my Wii U purchase.  Anything beyond that is gravy.  Sure, Nintendo needs more than that - but I don't.

 
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